Author Topic: Moved 8600 miles? Gladstonefamily.net Location or Elevation Problem  (Read 1353 times)

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Offline jerryg

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #25 on: November 06, 2019, 06:12:53 PM »
well i don't know what to do, i got on the china map for my location, mesowest says i recently moved to that location, but when i move the location pointer on the china map it doesn't give any location info to show change. I walked it all the way back to my location but it won't change anything because no location info is showing. Don't see why i have two maps, i know cwop went back to old location because of problems but that map which is correct won't move the pointer only the new china location moves without the lat and long showing so i guess i will have to move to china  :grin:. I think all this got screwed up when my upload location on wd changed  some of the info and dropped the - sign. I guess i will just have to wait and hope the corrected info on the upload page makes it to where it needs to go.

Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #26 on: November 06, 2019, 08:19:54 PM »
Jerry, I put a move request in. I matched the APRS location. Put your software to correct coordinates. You can see one doesn't have the negative. 8000 miles away.
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2019, 08:21:44 PM by ValentineWeather »
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Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #27 on: November 06, 2019, 08:47:08 PM »
If the software doesn't have a ( -) in front of the longitude it needs a W at the end. I'm pretty sure the software wasn't at fault because APRS has the correct location but somehow CWOP registered lost the correct hemisphere but worth checking.
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Offline jerryg

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #28 on: November 06, 2019, 08:53:20 PM »
Well i don't know how to get it right, i have the correct location now on my uplink to cwop but nothing changes and i can not get the correct location using the arrow, it doesn't work anymore.

Offline CW2274

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #29 on: November 06, 2019, 09:01:11 PM »

Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2019, 09:03:42 PM »
Well i don't know how to get it right, i have the correct location now on my uplink to cwop but nothing changes and i can not get the correct location using the arrow, it doesn't work anymore.

You should get a notice by email tomorrow if the move took.
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2019, 09:12:48 PM »
jerryg,
Inspecting your RAW APRS data I can see that your upload is not following proper APRS protocol with two infractions.

Your RAW APRS data:
K5SOI>APRS,TCPXX*,qAX,CWOP-3:@070150z28.77962/-96.83077_091/009g012t068r000p001P000b10194h89L000.WD 31

As you can see you have a negative in front of 96.83077. Proper APRS format is to use letters for the coordinates in your case N and W.

Also you are sending decimal coordinates instead of DM.m format.

See page 23:
http://www.aprs.org/doc/APRS101.PDF
« Last Edit: November 06, 2019, 09:35:18 PM by galfert »
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Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2019, 09:24:23 PM »
The decimal would have the negative. Degrees, mintutes, seconds needs a W. Not sure what software he uses.
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Offline jerryg

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2019, 09:25:02 PM »
I have always used the decimal location and had no problems for years.

Offline jerryg

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2019, 09:30:42 PM »
Ok i just put in the lat and long then converted it to the decimal with w and n so we will see how that works.

Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2019, 09:39:42 PM »
Jerry the decimal doesn't have a W. It needs the negative.

Your APRS was correct from what I could see. So I think the software is correct.

APRS Location recorded at 2019-Nov-07 02:02 UTC
This is correct:
Latitude: 28 46' 46" N (deg min sec), 28.7795 (decimal),
Longitude: 96 49' 49" W (deg min sec), -96.8303 (decimal)

Look at the coordinates in China it has an-( E )  and without the negative.

https://weather.gladstonefamily.net/site/AT358
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2019, 09:52:33 PM »
Format is right now but you've got Lat/Lon reversed.

K5SOI>APRS,TCPXX*,qAX,CWOP-3:@070235z9649.85N/02846.78W_093/008g012t067r000p001P000b10194h90L000.WD 31
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2019, 09:56:38 PM »
jerryg,
You can increase your upload to every 5 minutes instead of every 10 minutes.
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Offline jerryg

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2019, 10:16:07 PM »
Had a bad senior moment  :grin:.

Offline lightmaster

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #39 on: November 06, 2019, 10:56:05 PM »
Just to confirm, from what I can see in this thread, there's no point in trying to update my elevation with gladstonefamily right now? My elevation has also reverted back to the numbers I initially used when I set it up.

Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #40 on: November 06, 2019, 11:06:26 PM »
Just to confirm, from what I can see in this thread, there's no point in trying to update my elevation with gladstonefamily right now? My elevation has also reverted back to the numbers I initially used when I set it up.

Yes waiting on Philip Gladstone to resolve this database problem. His hands are tied as he is not getting cooperation from wxqa.com. I've tried too and I'm not getting a response from wxqa.com either.
:-(
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Offline lightmaster

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #41 on: November 06, 2019, 11:25:49 PM »
What's weird is that my CWOP elevation has changed too, MesoWest and NOAA.gov both show my elevation as 208ft (63.4m) but I had updated it to 211.2ft (64.4m) back at the end of Spring.

Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #42 on: November 07, 2019, 11:18:06 PM »
Good news! I heard back from Russ Chadwick (you know works at NOAA and was one of the key people in getting CWOP going). I'm basically being cc'd as Russ and Philip discuss the issues. Still just symptomatic discovery work going on now. No ETA.
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Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #43 on: November 08, 2019, 08:55:51 AM »
Surprised Jerry's registered position hasn't moved on Mesowest yet.  Gladstone takes a little longer.  Russ must not have got the request again.  ](*,)
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2019, 11:24:07 PM »
Update: The conversation has now escalated to include other NOAA individuals. It seems some changes have occurred (at NOAA - MADIS) that left Gladstonefamily.net out of the loop of some information that was being sent prior or the format has changed. This is all back end server talk and deals with how these back end systems interconnect and exchange information.
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Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2019, 03:24:30 AM »
Jerry is back in Texas after his China trip.  He thought Win10 update caused the original issue by leaving off the decimal on his longitude which in turn moved the registered position 8,300 miles to the eastern hemisphere. It also messed up his moon phase with WD software causing another issue. 
He did need to email Russ directly to get this resolved as I did so it looks like the normal procedure at Gladstone moving the arrow to the new location wasn't correctly sending a move request out.  I hope this gets resolved.

This win10 is another can of worms with its dreaded system updates changing software settings and the user unable to shut off and win7 no longer supported after Jan.
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2019, 05:28:06 AM »
This win10 is another can of worms with its dreaded system updates changing software settings

I'm pretty confident that Windows 10 updates do not cause software settings to change. I manage hundreds of computers across different companies. A software update may break a software but not cause an application setting to change. At least in this occasion this is definitely not the case. I'm sure I could get Brian the developer of Weather-Display to agree.

This issue of Gladstonefamily.net was caused by the site loosing access to other parts of the complex systems that make up CWOP. For some stations the registration has reverted to original registration data, which in many cases was erroneous information that was corrected by the registrant likely shortly after they first joined  CWOP.

Since a user upon noticing that their CWOP station suddenly has changed locations without them having made any changes it is reasonable to deduce that something on their end caused it to accur. Hence attributing the fault to Windows 10 Updates is but just a false conclusion. Decimal location changes in software were caused by the user looking to correct an issue where it didn't need fixing.

The thing to do now with Gladstonefamily.net is to just sit tight and be patient till this issue is resolved by the site. The rest of CWOP is working fine.

Windows 10 gets a lot of bad publicity for its forced updates. But I don't see this as a problem. Running a system without security updates is the problem that Microsoft has looked to solving. In the Enterprise these forced updates are not an issue because they can be controlled by system policies that are managed by company servers. For small companies and individuals it only presents a new way of dealing with these updates to ensure that running applications automatically resume operations, and there are ways to handle this, but Windows already does this in many occasions without user intervention. Software and users need to adapt to this new way of system updates for the sake of security. I'm not saying you have to take the bad, but rather software users need to change and integrate to this new way to work in unison with automatic updates. These automatic updates will all be a non-issue for those that learn to set things up properly, it already is a non-issue for many. Yes some of it can depend on software makers to update their software. It already is possible for people that know how to change software to run as a service and not as user mode. Figuring out ways to perpetually block Windows 10 from updating forever is looking at the situation with the wrong perspective, unless you plan to do scheduled updates manually on a consistent and timely basis. Staying with Windows 7 past Jan 14, 2020 is also the wrong approach.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2019, 05:51:41 AM by galfert »
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Offline ValentineWeather

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #47 on: November 14, 2019, 09:51:47 AM »
This win10 is another can of worms with its dreaded system updates changing software settings

I'm pretty confident that Windows 10 updates do not cause software settings to change. I manage hundreds of computers across different companies. A software update may break a software but not cause an application setting to change. At least in this occasion this is definitely not the case. I'm sure I could get Brian the developer of Weather-Display to agree.


Jerry seems to think just the opposite because he made no settings changes when all this occurred and puts the blame directly on windows10 update. I'll let Jerry defend himself if he chooses. He has emailed me several times and doesn't want to get in a pissing match publically. BTW I saw what your expertise looked like on networking so I believe what Jerry says is true. He had absolutely no reason to go into his software and start screwing with settings after years of running happily.
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Offline galfert

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Re: Moved 8600 miles?
« Reply #48 on: November 14, 2019, 12:00:31 PM »
BTW I saw what your expertise looked like on networking so I believe what Jerry says is true.

This is not the attitude of what we want to see on this forum. Any advice I've given if proven to not apply or serve to move in the direction of a solution does not indicate that it was bad or wrong advice. Without me remoting into a network it is but a possibility that was communicated to be investigated to see if it is a viable solution. I think what you said here is pretty clear and that is not acceptable.
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anything