Topic: Data Logger Alternative?

[kenwood850]

I am considering the purchase of the Vantage Pro2 and using my Slackware server that is on continuously to collect and store the generated data.  I looked at the information on the WeatherLink software and it does not appear that there is a Linux flavor available.  After looking around the web I found a software package the looks interesting (wview) but under requirements it says I still need to purchase the WeatherLink software to obtain a data logger even though the WeatherLink software is useless on a Linux box. 

I have looked at the Davis web site and other places to trying to determine what exactly the data logger is and there is not much information and without one to physically look at or play with I am at a loss.   Is there a forum member that can tell me technically speaking what the data logger consists of and what it does?   

I guess I am asking is there a way of rolling your own.  It appears rather foolish to purchase software when all you want to do is connect the console permanently to a server and collect the data as soon as it is generated.  Since it appears that Davis does not sell the data logger separately (or did I miss that) is there perhaps an aftermarket vendor that sells a similar device?

 

[JOE]

From what I can tell, Davis sells the data logger and throws in the software. They advertise it the other way around, sort of.

ie You cannot buy them separately.

[racenet]

The data logger is a hardware card that gets installed into your console and connects to your computer. It comes with software (Weatherlink) so that you can make use of it. If you do not wish to use that software, then by all means, use something else that will read the data logger. This all comes as a package deal and can not be bought seperate.



Bob

[kenwood850]

Thanks to both of you for replying.  That was the information I was looking for.  The sales literature does not make it clear that there is a card that has to be installed internally in the console to generate the output.  All I saw was the cable that went between the console and PC. 

I would have thought for not too much extra money, certainly less than the cost of a data logger, they could have put an RS-232 interface right in the console during manufacturing and sold the software separately for those that wanted it.  For $50 I added an RS-232 interface to my ID-4001 from d8apro.com and that also included a new main CPU with updated firmware.  I know I am in an area of the forum that is composed mostly of Davis fans, but it seems they nickel and dime you to death.  Actually it would not be too bad if it were only nickels and dimes.   

   

[racenet]

Well, as the saying goes, "You get what you pay for". 

[tomcj2]

Some people do not want to attach their weather station to a computer, and others buy an additional console to "walk around " with.  They do not want, or need the extra expense of the data logger.
Try ordering a car; an AWD Cadillac is $4000 more than a front wheel drive; If I want that car to be red I have to come up with $995 extra..

[SLOweather]

This subject has been beat up plenty here and on other forums. Davis is in the business to make money. This is how the do it. And, their design target was probably different than the way most of us here use the weather station. Keep in mind that they were putting loggers and serial connections in their weather stations before most of the other manufacturers, at a time when computers were not commodities, and were much more rare. WeatherLink can still be used to connect to multiple stations over phone lines and download the data from the loggers. Even now, that's unique.

Having designed and implemented a project that interfaces with the logger, I appreciate the engineering and documentation that Davis put into it.

Also, part of the money Davis makes off these goes to their exemplary tech support program. When I call Davis, the phone is usually answered by a real person. That person is in Hayward CA, not India, and speaks English I can understand. They are prompt with warranty repairs, willing to cross ship parts so that your station is down less time, and even their out if warranty repair charges are usually fair.

As Bob said,
"Well, as the saying goes, "You get what you pay for". "

[Garth Bock]

I went with an Envoy rather than a console and bought my ISS separate from a different vendor. I basically put together my own station the way I wanted it. My display is the computer monitor which I can see with more data displayed. Yeah you pay for the logger and you get software with it. However, in looking at all the other stations and even owning one of the lower cost ones for years that was too many separate parts and not very accurate I jumped on the Davis. Got one for work 3 years ago and got mine at home last year. I do have a spare logger (USB) but am not ready to part with it until a special project is done. As far as I understand the logger is more than just a serial interface but involves memory as well. Anyone is more specifics on that ?

[JOE]

I understand that the logger also stores your data.

If your computer is shut down, it will still store data until computer is back up and running, then the data is downloaded to the computer.
I've never really heard or read how much data or how long, but sounds like it could be a while.

Thought I read somewhere that someone shut their computer down and went on vacation.  When they got back, the logger had saved all the info.  The logger isn't "that" expensive.

I've certainly spent more and gotten less on other items.

[ncpilot]

Yes, depending on your update frequency, the logger can hold quite a bit of information... up to six months at the longest update interval...

[AndreGermain]

it's 2025, and for the cost of a Davis data logger, you can get a very low wattage mini PC and UPS and connect through the console or Envoy into the serial lines (thank you to so many for having worked this out back in the early 2010s). Why am I posting on such an old subject, because...

Lightning struck a tree 50 feet from my observatories and obliterated 5000$ CDN of electronics (buried cables), including a Davis Envoy 8x and it's data logger. I still had the console on hand (stored away for 10 years), so wired up an FTDI 232 in LSB mode, wham! Saved 700$ CDN and WeatherDisplay is happy. Why Davis is pushing data loggers on all of us when most don't need the logging part, shame on them, for the exorbitant pricing too. The parts in that logger are pennies.

... I moved over to 5G wifi narrow field antennae so I don't get fried again.

[johnd]

In 2025 most Davis stations no longer use separate loggers, unless you have an application that specially needs a legacy console/logger for some reason.

Also, 90% of Davis buyers wouldn’t know TTL from their elbows. The retail customers are typically older guys and are weather hobbyists not electronics hobbyists. But the majority of buyers these days are business users of one sort or another and are only interested in off the shelf solutions. For anyone that does have the knowledge then sure there are good alternative solutions to a legacy logger as you suggest, but it’s not for your average user whether retail or business.

[AndreGermain]

No doubt (totally agree.. I needed to rant after all my troubles), but a Davis VP2 lives on for 20 years or more, they're that good, and I'm not about to toss it out for a new system that would cost even more than a data logger and Envoy. Nevertheless, Davis should have offered a simple TTL serial solution for a fraction of the cost. When I bought it, I didn't even need the console, the Envoy was sufficient, but either I didn't read the docs well enough, or they don't say it plainly. Funny that the very same console saved me after the lightning strike. And yet another hit 500 feet from our house today and caused a fireball that went behind the vinyl siding and blew it out... one cat is missing too, but I digress.

Thanks for the reply.

[Mattk]

Lets be bluntly honest, loggers are basically not supported, secondary connections are not supported and especially the WLIP logger due to the subscription model, pure and simple, twist this one anyway one likes   

[AndreGermain]

yeah, I did not look much into this subscription bit, but if that is the only way to get data out of the box nowadays, that's just plain wrong. Whoever has been driving the show over at Davis for decades, seem they want handsome margins. I've seen some pretty bad VPs where I work that care so much for such that cost cutting leads to less for our customers, all the while getting their bonuses. Nice that 100K of bonus can causes 50M of damage over the long run, but then those individuals are long gone by the time we pick up the pieces. I digress.

[johnd]

I know some people really hate facts and much prefer prejudice, but just for the record:

1. WL loggers are not 'unsupported' in any sense that I recognise. Serial and USB loggers are still readily available. WLIP is deleted, granted, but more capable third-party alternatives are readily available as in WFL or MeteoPi or Meteobridge Nano, for example. We can debate the price of the Davis brand loggers, but that's a separate issue.

2. The newer 6313 console has a logger built in and so it would make no sense still to have a separate logger. The 6313 console also has software built in that provides much of the long-term logging and display functionality that many people need. The big beef of course is that the logged historical data is not currently available locally, except via the subscription and round-tripping to wl.com.

3. For users wanting a local data feed then the 6100 Weatherlink Live unit provides that (for wireless VP2 units, at least). And the legacy solution is still available in the form of an Envoy and a legacy logger.

4. If you do want the undoubted convenience of a cloud platform, as many users do, then there is obviously weatherlink.com. But I genuinely don't understand why people expect a powerful online platform like this to be completely free of charge. Who is meant to pick up the huge costs of developing and operating such a platform? So Davis run a mixed model where access to current data is free, but there is a fairly modest charge of $40-50pa for access to historical data. I don't know of many online services this inexpensive.

There are still holes in this overall picture of course and personally I would be delighted to see a local API added to the 6313 console firmware, eg to mimic what the WLL unit does. But please let's start from an honest assessment of what functionality is actually available right now.

[AndreGermain]

johnd: I can't discuss any of this on your level as I am still living with my VP2 back 15 years and have not had to do anything to it until this lightning strike, and weather isn't my thing, automated astronomical observatories are, so the VP2 is a lux item. Just glad I found a quick, cheap and dirty solution. No more ranting from me, promise 

[johnd]

johnd: I can't discuss any of this on your level as I am still living with my VP2 back 15 years and have not had to do anything to it until this lightning strike, and weather isn't my thing, automated astronomical observatories are, so the VP2 is a lux item. Just glad I found a quick, cheap and dirty solution. No more ranting from me, promise 

@AndreGermain : No problem, you're always polite and measured in your posts and delighted to see your replies. And in case it got lost in amongst the various other points, for anyone who does have the technical wherewithal to take a TTL feed direct from the console pins then that's great to see. Hopefully the 'mini PC' will have excellent up time and you won't miss the logging backup of the separate logger, but I hope it all works well for you. My only point specifically on this (before we got diverted on to other topics like the apparent scourge of an inexpensive subscription) was that there are relatively few Davis buyers who are technically competent to take this approach. But for those that are able to do so then it's obviously a good and potentially satisfying solution.

[davidmc36]

...the undoubted convenience of a cloud platform, ....

I was quite amazed at the viewing flexibility when using upgraded subscription. I had a peek with a trial last week. I personally have no requirements as I have CMx etc.

But for someone with a new console and no desire to run data at home????? It's a nice database.

Many other features available also.

(Not associated, just recent Fan Boy  )