Author Topic: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000  (Read 13263 times)

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Offline galfert

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #25 on: October 10, 2020, 06:07:26 PM »
You and Galfert saw my posts about my intention to work on it and didn't offer to help.

I didn't offer to help???? hu? All I do around here is help...and you've thanked me. I'm sorry but maybe I'm misunderstanding your request for help.

And I'm going to stick up for Mandrake too...which is an excellent member and also very helpful.

It is difficult to keep track of all threads to see what was discussed. So remind me again what help it is that you are not getting.



« Last Edit: October 10, 2020, 09:06:04 PM by galfert »
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Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2020, 09:37:19 PM »
Cheeriop,

As far as I know there has been no official release of the API, and frankly I don't expect one for general use (solely my opinion). There are perhaps some agreements that have been made to foster product growth with individuals with proven technology and already established uses. I am OK with that. These units are sold primarily "as is" to for people to use as a weather station.

There are other open avenues established , such as the custom server option, that , in reality, offers "near" the same benefits. As a developer , you should be able to understand how to use for your own benefit. The fact that there is a way to do this is extraordinary, sure, there is not documentation on it, and probably for good reason , such as the manufacturer would then have to support the documentation . Hence, you can peruse this forum and see how other's have done it.

I read back, I'm sorry, but I didn't see you requesting specific help from anyone, and as you can probably gather, this forum is not operated or moderated by the manufacturer (although they may comment)  of the products in question and advice given is purely voluntary. You seem to be getting upset that no one has offered you help for a question you have not really asked.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2020, 10:01:39 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:WS-2000,PM 2.5 x2,WH31B x2,WH40E,WH31P
EcoWitt: GW1100,GW1000 x4,WH31 x2,WH57,WH51 x12, WH40,WH5360B,WN34S
Web Sites: WU, Ambient Weather , Ecowitt.net , Ecowitt.net (TEST)
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline cheeroip

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #27 on: October 11, 2020, 06:22:51 PM »
Oh, I'm not upset at all and I'm not expecting or asking any help from anybody and I'm sorry to drag galfert into this argument.
It was just a general rant about how these things are usually managed and triggered  by mandrake that with:

"...you can approach Ecowitt directly through Lucy or via Galfert or myself and we might be able to provide the API documentation."

seem to imply that they're holding  the "Secret book of knowledge" for whatever reason I don't really care about in this specific case [tup]

I usually post around because having people interested just boost a bit my energy and enthusiasm level and check how different they feel about things  but I enjoy doing things regardless because I like the challenges
 
Stay safe everybody and happy 2021

Offline galfert

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #28 on: October 11, 2020, 08:11:15 PM »
So by lack of help you are referring to nobody handing you the API that practically nobody has. Mandrake doesn't have so I'm not sure why he gets thrown under the bus. I have it but I'm under NDA. The 3rd party software developers have it by having worked through me and they are also under NDA. That also means that I have any no say nor control over the availability of the API. I'm only acting under Ecowitt's strict orders. Several users like Mandrake, Olicat, Rover1822 and I have offered you other perspectives and options to work within the Ecowitt protocol. We have also explained why the API is under such tight control. If you still don't agree with the state of things then there is nobody to take that up with other than Ecowitt. I would therefore conclude that it is not true that nobody is offering help. Everyone mentioned has done everything that they can do to provide you with the information that they can give you.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2020, 09:04:26 PM by galfert »
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Online Mandrake

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #29 on: October 12, 2020, 08:50:00 AM »
Agree with Galfert that its not anyone's intention to withhold information that can be freely shared!

Perhaps I chose my wording poorly, but what I was suggesting was that if you have a genuine application idea that you feel worthy you could discuss with Galfert or I and we could broker the discussion with Ecowitt (Lucy) or you can cut out the middlemen and go direct to Lucy which in the circumstances would probably be best!

As Galfert has stated our relationship with Ecowitt is on a trust basis and neither of us would wish to break their trust so cannot directly share such documentation and knowledge that we have without their consent. This is with the full intention of furthering the needs of the enthusiast community.
I hope that you understand the position we are in and trying to achieve for all. After all there are few manufacturers around that engage with their community as does Ecowitt/Fine Offset.
G1ZFO

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Offline cheeroip

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2020, 07:22:38 PM »
So by lack of help you are referring to nobody handing you the API that practically nobody has. Mandrake doesn't have so I'm not sure why he gets thrown under the bus. I have it but I'm under NDA. The 3rd party software developers have it by having worked through me and they are also under NDA. That also means that I have any no say nor control over the availability of the API.

No, I never asked for any help and I'm not throwing anybody under any bus.

I'm an hobbist that like to tinker. I shared with other hobbists that I was going to play with the GW1000 protocol.

I had no idea about any documentation, if anybody is under any NDA or any legal obligation about querying a device connected to my network; I saw other people playing with it and I thought it could have be helpful for other people.

Implementing an API query is matter of few hours and completely legal with the owner blessing and documentation versus days of sniffing packets, reverse engineering and potentially illegal without the documentation.

I'm probably going to do it regardless and not sharing my progress on here since Ecowitt official position about it and I'm assuming full responsability for doing it.


I installed (the very impressive) Cumuls MX and they seem to have implemented the protocol and release the source code
(that would be pretty much like having the documentation).

Ofcourse they have their own legal and documentation problems:
Note: Cumulus MX is strictly for non-commercial, non-government use only. It contains products produced by Highsoft which are not free for commercial and governmental use.

Thanks Galfert for clarify your, Ecowitt and Mandrake position.
 

Offline DevilDoc

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #31 on: November 14, 2020, 06:44:38 PM »
You can add the soil moisture sensor (WH31SM), lightning detector (WH31L), Leak Detector (WH31La), and Probed thermometer (WH31P) to the WS2000.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2020, 06:51:11 PM by DevilDoc »

Offline galfert

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #32 on: November 14, 2020, 07:49:46 PM »
You can add the soil moisture sensor (WH31SM), lightning detector (WH31L), Leak Detector (WH31La), and Probed thermometer (WH31P) to the WS2000.

True. As this is an old thread now that is just over a year old, things have changed...for the better. I'm not going to revise the original post to cover these new sensors. But there isn't much need to do so anyway for two reasons. First this thread is about the differences and some of these new sensors are common to both stations. This thread is about the differences. The other reason is because there is a new thread that will hopefully better serve as a way to document all of the sensor possibilities that all of these stations can support:
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=40730.0
Ecowitt GW1000 | Meteobridge on Raspberry Pi
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Offline DevilDoc

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #33 on: November 14, 2020, 07:55:07 PM »
whoops, didn't mean to necro the thread.  Having installed the WS-2000 today I was going through the forums and saw the graphic was lacking those. 

I'll check out the new thread.

Thanks!

Offline Paul Enright

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #34 on: May 31, 2021, 09:22:33 AM »
Thanks, @galfret for all these comparisons. I hope it is OK to post to an old thread. It is sticky so I assuming it is ok.  :grin:

From the OP you said this about the GW1000.
The Ecowitt GW1000 is a very powerful option to ether Ambient or Ecowitt station (or other Fine Offset). This is primarily because it is the only console to support a local network API. This local network API allows you to expand the capabilities of your station to easily support all sensors with no technical know-how, because you don't need to know how to use API's. All you need to do is install the compatible 3rd party software and point it to the GW1000's IP address and you are done. For now the compatible 3rd party software to take advantage of this API is Cumulus MX, Meteobridge and Weather-Display. The Meteobridge is software you run on a TP-Link travel router and Weather-Display is software that you can run on a computer with various operating system (PC, Mac, or Linux like a Raspberry Pi). There are other ways to get your data to yet other software even without the GW1000 but that requires a bit more technical know how (like WeeWx, but WeeWx will soon support the local API). It is especially challenging using Ambient to get redirected data because there is no "Customized Server" settings in their consoles, which is why having the GW1000 is such a nice enhancement.

I was wondering if anything has changed? I am looking at the GW1000 for the custom server (API) option. I would like to pull the sensors into Home Assistant. Have they added exposed API to the 2000? This is my first PWS and I debating if I need a console. I know the spousal support will be better if she does not have to load the HA app to see the sensor data. I am in the US.

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #35 on: May 31, 2021, 10:55:46 AM »
AFAIK Weewx now support LAN API through a plugin.

Unfortunately I don'y know if HASS support these API, maybe the custom server.

There is also the FOSHKplugin that, configured as server were you push GW1000 data, then can push data to a LOT of services.

There is an app on Android (maybe iOS too) that can pull data from GW1000 and show them as a console. Or you can use just Wsview.

There is an app for windows that can pull data from GW1000.

Ecowitt will be publish soon the API for pulling data from Ecowitt.net

Offline Paul Enright

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #36 on: May 31, 2021, 11:47:35 AM »
Unfortunately I don'y know if HASS support these API, maybe the custom server.
Thanks for your answer, but I did not ask the question right. Let me add a little context.
I know the GW-1000 will work with Ha, what I am curious if the WS-2000 has been upgraded to support an open API? My assumption is no since that would obsolete the GW-1000.

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #37 on: May 31, 2021, 12:37:37 PM »
Hard to say because Ambient is sold in USA at 915MHz and has a custom firmware.
Looking here
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=40730.0
WS-2000 should be an HP2551 rebranded but maybe with different firmware.
If it works with WsView like HP2551 I believe that it uses the same Ecowitt LAN API but I am not sure. But you can try for free!
If not I believe that it uses a different API protocol but should be not very different.

Online olicat

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #38 on: May 31, 2021, 12:52:47 PM »
Hi!

Quote
I know the GW-1000 will work with Ha, what I am curious if the WS-2000 has been upgraded to support an open API?
We'd have to first clarify what is actually meant by API.

The GW1000 offers different ways to transfer the data:
1. custom server
an ASCII line is sent at intervals from the GW1000 to any address via http / POST
2. GW1000 API
offers prepared programs the possibility to query the current weather data from the GW1000
3. Network API - e.g. at ecowitt.net (but also e.g. Awekas)
enables the query of the data that has already been uploaded from the GW1000 to ecowitt.net or the respective cloud provider

Ambient Weather stations do not offer the GW1000 API - this is only available for GW1000 and WH2650.
Ambient also offers the custom server function (although the keys look slightly different and the software must explicitly support this Ambient Weather format).
There is also a network API from Ambient. But this is also different from the Ecowitt network API.

However, I don't know which procedure HA can use.
I mean, even if HA supports any GW1000 protocol, it doesn't mean that HA can handle data from an Ambient Weather station.
The safe way should then be to purchase a GW1000.

Regards, Oliver

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #39 on: May 31, 2021, 01:12:35 PM »
Oliver , thanks for doing the API clarification. I was about to do it, but you did it better

Quote
Ambient also offers the custom server function (although the keys look slightly different and the software must explicitly support this Ambient Weather format).
There is also a network API from Ambient. But this is also different from the Ecowitt network API.

I just checked the custom server option via WSView for my WS-2000. Although I did not test it, it offers both the Ambient output, and the WU output (at least that is what is shown on the screen, if I get really bored I will set up an intercept of them)

As I have the WS-2000 and GW1000s , it is kind of redundant for me to work with the WS-2000 output, as I get what I need from the GW1000.
That being said, if you want the pressure and indoor temp from the WS-2000 then you would use that custom server option using the Ambient protocol. If I remember right the WU protocol doesn't even bother to send out the indoor temp as it is not used at WU.

As far as what was mentioned about having access to the API (whatever one) for the WS-2000 would make the GW1000 obsolete. No, although Fine Offset manufactured, Ambient does not market the GW1000. It might make it unneeded to use the API functions , but obsolete, nope.

We really should come up with a better phraseology or acronym for the custom server option and stop pretending it is an API, because it isn't. And yes I just used it all over the place, lol.

- Rover
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 01:14:54 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:WS-2000,PM 2.5 x2,WH31B x2,WH40E,WH31P
EcoWitt: GW1100,GW1000 x4,WH31 x2,WH57,WH51 x12, WH40,WH5360B,WN34S
Web Sites: WU, Ambient Weather , Ecowitt.net , Ecowitt.net (TEST)
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #40 on: May 31, 2021, 01:19:02 PM »
Ambient Weather stations do not offer the GW1000 API - this is only available for GW1000 and WH2650.
Here
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=40730.0
it seems that WS-2000 is an HP2551 rebranded.
Going down it's shown that HP2551 appears on WSview, but I don't know if WSview can get live data like it do on GW1000. I don't know what happens when you click on it.
There is a comparison here
Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=37760.0 (edit, it's the first post of this thread!  :oops:)
but I didn't find if you can pull data from this console or not or if you can set a custom server upload so you can use FOSHKplugin or other software.

@Rover11822
Yes in WU you don't have the internal temperature.
I don't know what Ambient offers since is not available for non Ambient customers or Meteobridge customers.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 04:20:29 PM by zoomx »

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #41 on: May 31, 2021, 01:25:00 PM »
Ambient Weather stations do not offer the GW1000 API - this is only available for GW1000 and WH2650.
Here
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=40730.0
it seems that WS-2000 is an HP2551 rebranded.
Going down it's shown that HP2551 appears on WSview, but I don't know if WSview can get live data like it do on GW1000. I don't know what happens when you click on it.
There is a comparison here
Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=37760.0
but I didn't find if you can pull data from this console or not or if you can set a custom server upload so you can use FOSHKplugin or other software.

@Rover11822
Yes in WU you don't have the internal temperature.
I don't know what Ambient offers since is not available for non Ambient customers or Meteobridge customers.

I think Galfert or someone else did an intercept of the Ambient WS-2000, and I apologize for not remembering who, and being too lazy to search. :)
WSView does not show live data for a WS-2000. It does allow some configurations, like outbound http for the various servers, like the custom server
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 01:36:09 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:WS-2000,PM 2.5 x2,WH31B x2,WH40E,WH31P
EcoWitt: GW1100,GW1000 x4,WH31 x2,WH57,WH51 x12, WH40,WH5360B,WN34S
Web Sites: WU, Ambient Weather , Ecowitt.net , Ecowitt.net (TEST)
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #42 on: May 31, 2021, 02:26:08 PM »
OK I got bored for a few and stuck up a listener for the ws-2000 , this is for mine, using the Ambient protocol (yes, doze, .net, don't hit me)
But regardless, the request (get), is going to be the same, no matter how you listen for it (programming language, wireshark (but you would need an open port) , etc). And I believe Oliver has already played with this

request:

Code: [Select]
/data/report/stationtype=AMBWeatherV4.2.9&PASSKEY=NONOFYOURDAMDBUSINESS&dateutc=2021-05-31+18:13:27&tempinf=69.4&battin=1&humidityin=60&baromrelin=30.304&baromabsin=30.304&tempf=66.9&battout=1&humidity=67&winddir=31&winddir_avg10m=299&windspeedmph=2.5&windspdmph_avg10m=0.9&windgustmph=5.8&maxdailygust=10.3&hourlyrainin=0.000&eventrainin=0.000&dailyrainin=0.000&weeklyrainin=0.327&monthlyrainin=1.736&yearlyrainin=16.268&solarradiation=710.53&uv=6&temp1f=64.4&humidity1=71&temp2f=73.8&humidity2=58&temp7f=-0.9&temp8f=3.6&batt1=1&batt2=1&batt7=1&batt8=1&pm25=9.0&pm25_24h=12.7&batt_25=1&pm25_in=9.0&pm25_in_24h=14.0&batt_25in=1&batt_co2=1


And again, this is not an API, this is just a data push
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 02:59:01 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:WS-2000,PM 2.5 x2,WH31B x2,WH40E,WH31P
EcoWitt: GW1100,GW1000 x4,WH31 x2,WH57,WH51 x12, WH40,WH5360B,WN34S
Web Sites: WU, Ambient Weather , Ecowitt.net , Ecowitt.net (TEST)
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Online olicat

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #43 on: May 31, 2021, 03:12:20 PM »
Hi!

Quote
And I believe Oliver has already played with this
That's true. FOSHKplugin can also process Ambient Weather format. So you also could convert this to Ecowitt, save to InfluxDB or feed an MQTT server.
But HA is not a known target yet.

The Ambient keys are slightly different than these from Ecowitt - e.g. for soil moisture and the WH57 (lightning). But there're some other differences.
Back to topic: what is needed for connecting to HA? (I still recommend the safe way to buy a additional GW1000 if it is deemed to work reliably with HA.)

Oliver

Regards, Oliver
« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 03:20:22 PM by olicat »

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #44 on: May 31, 2021, 03:33:43 PM »
OK, let's forget the Ambient protocol push for a second. If the push is WU, and the goal is based on rainfall, that should be more generic

but if you have Ambient branded soil moisture sensors , well then it gets a little more complicated. I would still use the GW1000 .

(other words , I agree)




« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 03:36:58 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:WS-2000,PM 2.5 x2,WH31B x2,WH40E,WH31P
EcoWitt: GW1100,GW1000 x4,WH31 x2,WH57,WH51 x12, WH40,WH5360B,WN34S
Web Sites: WU, Ambient Weather , Ecowitt.net , Ecowitt.net (TEST)
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline cheeroip

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #45 on: May 31, 2021, 03:38:51 PM »


WSView does not show live data for a WS-2000. It does allow some configurations, like outbound http for the various servers, like the custom server

This market have so much confusion for  no reason:

The WS2000 is a Bundle (console+sensors) and cost 280 dollars.
The WS2000 is also just the console at 180 dollars
The GW1000 cost 35 bucks and does what a console does but without a display...

All consoles upload their data to X internet services.

The GW1000 support every sensors that the WS2000 support (and more)
ONLY GW1000 and the WH2650  server sensor data on a local network.


The software WSView get the data directly from the Consoles; not from the sensors or weather stations, not from internet.


Everything should be pretty obvious, simple and straightforward but obviously isn't.






Offline zoomx

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #46 on: May 31, 2021, 04:22:20 PM »
Maybe there will be the WS1900 (or WN1900), similar to GW1000 but with a display!

Offline cheeroip

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Re: Ambient WS-2000 vs. Ecowitt HP2551 - plus GW1000
« Reply #47 on: May 31, 2021, 04:29:46 PM »
Maybe there will be the WS1900 (or WN1900), similar to GW1000 but with a display!
That seem a great idea.
But I still love the concept of a really small cheap modular minimal GW1000 style solution