Author Topic: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range  (Read 13206 times)

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Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2021, 08:10:01 AM »
If you have a battery AM radio you can tune near 500kHz and listen to the noise in your house and maybe find the EMI/RFI noise source.
Tested and confirmed (AM radio not required):
  • WH57 was kept in the lowest sensitivity setting with all 4 dip switches in the down position, per the user manual page 10.
  • I put the WH57 near an extension cord and/or outlet beside the furthest PoE adapter I have in my home. No other appliances or devices were running at this time.
  • When the PoE adapter was plugged in, the WH57 red LED turned on immediately for 2 sec repeatedly which per the user manual page 12 confirms detection of interference signals.
  • When unplugged, the red LED did not turn at all.
  • Repeated test and putting the WH57 in close proximity to other PoE adapters that were already running and same behaviour was confirmed.
The good thing is I previously rewired my breaker panel so that most of the noise is on the same phase (for fastest data speeds), although the neutral is obviously shared. Will keep trying to move my WH57 as far as possible to see if I can minimize the effects.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2021, 08:54:43 AM »
PoE usually means Power over Ethernet, not Powerline, if I am not totally wrong.

I have a couple of Powerline too, never used since years, maybe I will made some tests. But in Italy I have only one phase, three phase are not common in houses.

Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #27 on: April 16, 2021, 09:02:51 AM »
Many different acronyms I guess. I'm probably wrong for that! As well, we normally have just 2 phases in our homes here Canada.

If you have a chance to test, additional validation is always helpful. For sure I am certain for this EMI/RFI issue at least.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #28 on: April 16, 2021, 09:19:04 AM »
Powerline in the terms of ethernet is usually a way use your house electrical wiring as opposed to cat cables or WiFi to extend your ethernet signal (adapters plug into your electrical receptacles). PoE, is manner of transmitting power down a cat cable along with the ethernet signal to power an end point device like a security camera so that only one wire is required to the device, as opposed to having a separate power connection to the device, this can be done with a power injector that plugs into a receptacle, or from PoE enabled switches.

I routinely get noise on my SDR from my PoE powered devices, some are worse than others and shielded cat6 or better helps, and the end point device can also be the culprit. I had one security camera that was basically acting like an antenna due to poor internal shielding.

I don't have any experience with Powerline.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 09:37:51 AM by Rover1822 »
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Offline zoomx

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #29 on: April 18, 2021, 10:27:32 AM »
Test made.
My WH57 is in high sesitivity, dip switch 3 is up, 4 is down.
I used a couple of old TP-Link TL-PA211, one close to the router, the other in a room near the WH57 sensor, about 3m or 10 feet, there is a concrete wall with a window and a door.
I live in a city.

Got no noise, still have zero counts in lightning.

I am lucky since other user in italian forum get some noise sometimes.

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2021, 10:40:03 AM »
According to Lucy, the new updated WH57 is the one they are currently selling on the ecowitt.com website. Its still called the WH57 and supposedly addresses "two points: frequency calibration and instability issues".

My current WH57 does get 0 to 6 false strikes a day on high settings. I'm not to bothered by this (because i'm used to it by now so I just set the alerts for greater than 7 strikes).

Has anybody recently tried out the new WH57? I guess if don't have the older one, you may not know what you are missing.
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Offline broadstairs

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2021, 10:46:49 AM »
I got my WH57 at the start of April and so far I've tried to get false strikes but to no avail :roll: I did force one by holding it within an inch of a light switch but that was to see what happened on Weather Display  ;) So I'm guessing I have the latest model. Need to get some thunder storms to test it properly but right now we're not even having rain forecast  :roll:

Stuart
Ecowitt GW1003 with ultrasonic wind gauge, lightning sensor and PM2.5 sensor with Personal Weather Tablet as a console.

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2021, 10:52:37 AM »
that's interesting to know. I do know that even some of the older ones are working pretty well, without any false strikes. Sometimes mine can go days without a false strike.

Could you share a picture of your detector? Maybe there is a designation somewhere on the back or inside the battery compartment. This way, I can compare it to mine and post any differences.
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Offline broadstairs

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2021, 10:59:26 AM »
There is little point as I can see no identification on it anywhere and it looks just like the Ecowitt picture on their website.

Stuart
Ecowitt GW1003 with ultrasonic wind gauge, lightning sensor and PM2.5 sensor with Personal Weather Tablet as a console.

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2021, 11:09:28 AM »
that's what I thought.
Ecowitt WH2320-E
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Ecowitt WH41 (Honeywell-based USB/Supercap modified)
Ecowitt WH31 (x8)
Ecowitt WH55 (x4)
Ecowitt WH45
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Offline Gyvate

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2021, 11:24:15 AM »
Here is a picture of mine - never mind the text on the front side - probably repurposing the case
From left to right: front - back - back opened (under the batteries is nothing - i.e. no text, structure etc.)
it's works meticulously - no false positives - only real strikes (if they occur) - placed outside on the terrace.
operational since July 2020.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2021, 12:46:42 PM by Gyvate »
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Online olicat

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2021, 11:46:09 AM »
Hi!

Quote
I do know that even some of the older ones are working pretty well, without any false strikes.
I've had my WH57 in operation since May 2nd, 2020 and I've never seen a faulty strike.
During thunderstorms, however, it also shows lightning.

In the German weather station forum I don't read about constant false positives either.
I can't imagine that, but maybe the problem only affects devices that do not transmit in 868MHz?

Oliver

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2021, 11:48:39 AM »
Hi Oliver, these are good points you raise. It's really hard to pinpoint this problem whether it's an environmental or a sensor issue. The fact that they updated the sensor really doesn't mean that the old one is defective perhaps they're updating it to accommodate more environmental conditions. My thoughts.
Ecowitt WH2320-E
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Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2021, 11:59:27 AM »
Hi!

Quote
I do know that even some of the older ones are working pretty well, without any false strikes.
I've had my WH57 in operation since May 2nd, 2020 and I've never seen a faulty strike.
During thunderstorms, however, it also shows lightning.

In the German weather station forum I don't read about constant false positives either.
I can't imagine that, but maybe the problem only affects devices that do not transmit in 868MHz?

Oliver

I'm running one at 915MHz, no issues, only true positives during storms, I really can't imagine that the radio frequency for data transmissions would make a difference.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2021, 12:01:37 PM by Rover1822 »
Ambient:
  WS-2000
  PM 2.5(2)
  WH31B(2)
  WH40E
  WH31P
EcoWitt:
  GW1100
  GW1000(4)
  WH31(2)
  WH57
  WH51(12),
  WH40
  WH5360B
  WN34S
  WittBoy WS90 + GW2000
  WS90 (other one) + GW1100
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #39 on: April 26, 2021, 04:54:12 PM »
Not much of an update, but Ecowitt will be sending me a replacement WH57 unit. When it arrives, I'll post here to see if there is any change in behaviour. My current WH57 still continues to report numerous false positives each day.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2021, 09:41:13 PM »
Any updates on the new lightning detector?
Ecowitt WH2320-E
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Ecowitt WH69E
Ecowitt WH32B
Ecowitt WH57 (x3)
Ecowitt WH51 (x6)
Ecowitt WH41
Ecowitt WH41 (Honeywell-based USB/Supercap modified)
Ecowitt WH31 (x8)
Ecowitt WH55 (x4)
Ecowitt WH45
Ecowitt WN34S (x2)
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Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #41 on: May 27, 2021, 10:57:51 PM »
I received the new unit just two days ago. At first, the number of false positives went down but now it is back up and quite high. The dip switches came all down in the lower position. I'm testing it in a few different locations and will report back but not so hopeful at the moment.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #42 on: May 28, 2021, 12:24:38 PM »
Get an AM radio and tune it to the lowest frequency, should be about 530KHz.
Then hear for noise.

Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #43 on: May 28, 2021, 04:08:22 PM »
Get an AM radio and tune it to the lowest frequency, should be about 530KHz. Then hear for noise.
Same results as carrying my WH57 and placing it near suspected noise sources. It is a little more sensitive to check other areas, but there is a notable difference between 'normal' static near 530kHz versus digital noise. Even at the lowest sensitivity setting, it is still too sensitive.

Hard to get a baseline "sound" in these areas with a working household. I'll have to pick a specific time and day to turn everything off including my UPS to test.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #44 on: May 29, 2021, 06:38:36 AM »
Inside WH57 sensor there is a Franklin  AS3935 chip thas uses a ma5532-ae 500kHz ceramic antenna. You can find this chip and antenna in other lightning sensor and also in little board for Arduino.
If you have a battery AM radio you can tune near 500kHz and listen to the noise in your house and maybe find the EMI/RFI noise source.

That's the reason I am talking about AM radio. Noise is easily recognized against static, try near a dishwasher or a washing machine. But if you feel better using the WH57  no problem.

I am lucky, two WH57 and they works without any problems, I check against Blitzortung.

Offline broadstairs

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #45 on: May 29, 2021, 06:54:36 AM »
I think I must be lucky as I have mine set to its most sensitive and so far no false readings as far as I can tell, mine was delivered at the end of March 2021 so it pretty new. I think my location means I can pick up strikes beyond the 25 mile radius as I am about 140 feet ASL and only 800 yards from the English Channel so we have a clear line of sight to France on a clear day and I'm sure I pick up strikes well out to sea perhaps even in France ;)

There could be external reasons for false readings, are there any overhead power cables nearby or are you near any military buildings or any radio/tv  or local ham radio antennae, are you near an airport with ground level radar, any nearby electrically powered railway lines? Any of this kind of thing could cause problems either directly or by amplifying the noise.

Stuart
Ecowitt GW1003 with ultrasonic wind gauge, lightning sensor and PM2.5 sensor with Personal Weather Tablet as a console.

Offline Autofill

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #46 on: May 29, 2021, 12:19:25 PM »
thanks for the update.  Seems the new WH57 might need more tinkering like the first version.

I have the first version, and get about 0 to 3 false strikes a day on DDDD and (1 to 6 if I have it on DDUD).

Yesterday, we had a storm and it was on the highest setting, DDUD, didn't pick any strikes. I then changed it to default, DDDD, it started to pick up strikes.

Its a bit flakey for sure.
Ecowitt WH2320-E
Ecowitt HP2551-C (SOLD - replaced with Home Assistant Fully Kiosk FireTab HD10)
Ecowitt GW1000
Ecowitt GW1100
Ecowitt WH69E
Ecowitt WH32B
Ecowitt WH57 (x3)
Ecowitt WH51 (x6)
Ecowitt WH41
Ecowitt WH41 (Honeywell-based USB/Supercap modified)
Ecowitt WH31 (x8)
Ecowitt WH55 (x4)
Ecowitt WH45
Ecowitt WN34S (x2)
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Offline solartempest

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #47 on: May 29, 2021, 06:05:27 PM »
There could be external reasons for false readings, are there any overhead power cables nearby or are you near any military buildings or any radio/tv  or local ham radio antennae, are you near an airport with ground level radar, any nearby electrically powered railway lines? Any of this kind of thing could cause problems either directly or by amplifying the noise.
I mean... there are a lot of potential EMI/RFI sources but I'm not sure how most people will identify them or the magnitude of the interference caused by each. There is not much homeowners can really do about them and these are all very common/essential in any major city. For my location:
  • All the power distribution in my subdivision is underground.
  • 3-phase overhead circuits are on the nearest main street but the size/number of obstructions and distance is unlikely to cause such significant problems. They are medium voltage and on poles not steel transmission towers.
  • No airports nearby.
  • No electrical railways nearby.
  • No military nearby.
  • No HAM repeaters nearby. Not even sure how you can find local HAM user antennas?
  • No radar nearby.
  • There are radiocommunications antennae nearby. Not sure if the broadcast frequencies are public information.
As an aside, I do work on critical industrial equipment that is highly susceptible to noise and have been part of detailed EMI/RFI testing of equipment and the associated industry standards/requirements. All the care and design strategies we utilize there are essentially impossible for home owners to implement.


My testing update: I completed my testing with all the power in my home turned off. The results were interesting. With the AM radio at 530kHz, I was able to test the different areas for interference. The amount of noise on the incoming power cables from the utility do have some noise even within galvanized conduit, which isn't that surprising. Not a huge amount, but it is there.

What was most interesting is that even with all breakers isolated, one set of power cables was still radiating noise. This is because I share one wall with a neighbour. The unshielded, untwisted wires have some inductive coupling which adds noise on those particular power cables. Placing the WH57 adjacent to these cables has enough noise to trigger the LED to flicker and indicate there is a problem.

Also noted is that when my UPS perform their line-interactive self tests, the rectifiers do have bursts of EMI/RFI which is likely problematic with the WH57 sensor circuit. Those tests run on a regular basis, so something to keep in mind for all those who have UPS or multiple UPS in their home. Myself, I had suspected this may happen and had already sited my WH57 far away from them.

I also reconfirmed the interference from my powerline ethernet adapters. Even though mine are all wired to the same phase, still there are emissions to some extent on the other power circuits in my home. This makes the WH57 placement quite difficult. The good thing is that the sensor does have noise sensing capability and indication (as I previously mentioned) so you can use it to identify major noise sources. The bad thing is that the unit is so sensitive that you can still encounter a lot of trouble even if you locate the unit some distance away.

Right now my only potential solution is to locate the WH57 as far as my home as possible but still within communications range of my GW1000 and HP2551. Easier said than done because the unit does not seem like it can be directly exposed to the elements. Plus I need to make sure it does not get stolen or damaged outside somehow.


Overall: Not a very promising situation and frankly I'm a bit frustrated. At this point, I find it very difficult to recommend anybody to buy a WH57. Still open to suggestions but the newer replacement version I received directly from Ecowitt still has similar issues.
Ecowitt GW1000, HP2553BC, WS80, WH51x4, WH41, WH45, WH40, WH32, WH31x2, WH57x2.

Offline Rover1822

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #48 on: May 29, 2021, 09:06:49 PM »
"Overall: Not a very promising situation and frankly I'm a bit frustrated. At this point, I find it very difficult to recommend anybody to buy a WH57. Still open to suggestions but the newer replacement version I received directly from Ecowitt still has similar issues."

Yeah, I fully understand your frustration. But on the other hand , they work just perfectly fine for a lot of us. I have no idea how many have been purchased , or how many have good or bad results. I can say that mine works as designed and honestly I only see events when there is an actual storm.

I am not trying to trivialize your results, but as you have gathered, there is something in your environment that is triggering it.

 

Ambient:
  WS-2000
  PM 2.5(2)
  WH31B(2)
  WH40E
  WH31P
EcoWitt:
  GW1100
  GW1000(4)
  WH31(2)
  WH57
  WH51(12),
  WH40
  WH5360B
  WN34S
  WittBoy WS90 + GW2000
  WS90 (other one) + GW1100
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline zoomx

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Re: Ecowitt WH57 lightning detector sensitivy vs range
« Reply #49 on: May 30, 2021, 04:27:43 AM »
Now I have powerline in testing from about 3 weeks. One of them is at about 3 or 4 meters from one WH57. No interference.

Remember that when the WH57 is first turned on inserting batteries it is performes  noise level estimation so when you move it the estimation may not be good. I don't know if the estimation is done periodically.

I have the Franklin chip alone, as a board that can be connected to Arduino or others MCU. If I use simple sketch (the flittle programs for Arduino are called sketch) it catch a lot of false event so the source code must be tuned to avoid them.

 

anything