Author Topic: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed  (Read 6213 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« on: May 28, 2023, 08:34:08 AM »
I received and installed the new TROPO gauge yesterday. It looks good, and the accessories (brush and hand grip) are nice to have. I like the special features, like the tapered inner cylinder funnel, etc.

It is quite a bit longer and narrower than the original gauge.

I'll order spare outer cylinders and get the gram mass before the snow flies...

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline WheatonRon

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • WUnderground
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2023, 10:19:48 AM »
Since the Tropo gauge costs $100, or 2.5 times the cost of a stratus gauge, does it include washing your car for you on a monthly basis? Have you contacted the CoCoRaHS folks to get a new station ID that designates that your measurements are from a Tropo gauge instead of the stratus gauge? Obviously sarcasm in my first point but read somewhere that getting a new ID is desirable.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2023, 10:51:06 AM by WheatonRon »
Davis VP2 with SHT31 (3 complete VP2 systems—2 with a daytime fan and 1 that has a 24 hour fan); CWOP--CW5020, FW3075 and FW4350; WU--KILWHEAT17, KILWHEAT36 and KILWHEAT39; WeatherCloud.net; CoCoRaHS--IL-DP-132; and Weatherlink 2.0

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2023, 11:08:47 AM »
Since the Tropo gauge costs $100, or 2.5 times the cost of a stratus gauge, does it include washing your car for you on a monthly basis? Have you contacted the CoCoRaHS folks to get a new station ID that designates that your measurements are from a Tropo gauge instead of the stratus gauge? Obviously sarcasm in my first point but read somewhere that getting a new ID is desirable.

Hmmm.... I haven't heard anything regarding this. I did make a note in the comments today regarding the gauge change. I'll send a query to CoCoRaHS about it and see what they say.

I used to make a note regarding using the weighing method for snow and even suggested to CoCoRaHS to have a check box if that method was used. Nolan thought it was a good idea, but apparently the logistics for changing the database were an obstacle so it didn't happen. I suspect that the same issue would occur if there was a selection for gauge type/brand.

There is a comment in the current blog. "The Catch" article mentions the new gauge, but nothing regarding needing a new ID. Personally, I think that since the IDs are location based, it doesn't make sense to change it.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline Cutty Sark Sailor

  • WxElement panel
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 3393
    • Frankfort Weather - TwinHollies WeatherCenter
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2023, 03:31:57 PM »
You need to change nothing...
 


Offline ocala

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2023, 04:53:05 PM »
I received and installed the new TROPO gauge yesterday. It looks good, and the accessories (brush and hand grip) are nice to have. I like the special features, like the tapered inner cylinder funnel, etc.

It is quite a bit longer and narrower than the original gauge.

I'll order spare outer cylinders and get the gram mass before the snow flies...

Greg H.
Just curious if you left your old coco up to compare readings.
The blues had a baby and they named it Rock & Roll

Offline CW2274

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 6731
    • Conditions @ CW2274 West Tucson-Painted Hills Ranch
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2023, 05:59:54 PM »

Offline WheatonRon

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • WUnderground
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2023, 08:02:26 PM »
At least a little more reasonable here...

https://weatheryourway.com/products/tropo-4-precipitation-gauge

Wrong. This place charges $11.25 for shipping making it exactly $100 plus tax.

However, irrespective of price, this Tropo gauge hype seems over the top—particularly in the winter. Capturing precipitation in this gauge or “the prior official gauge” aka the Stratus gauge, in the wintertime when snow is blowing around is at best a good faith estimate.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2023, 08:10:35 PM by WheatonRon »
Davis VP2 with SHT31 (3 complete VP2 systems—2 with a daytime fan and 1 that has a 24 hour fan); CWOP--CW5020, FW3075 and FW4350; WU--KILWHEAT17, KILWHEAT36 and KILWHEAT39; WeatherCloud.net; CoCoRaHS--IL-DP-132; and Weatherlink 2.0

Offline CW2274

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 6731
    • Conditions @ CW2274 West Tucson-Painted Hills Ranch
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2023, 08:16:28 PM »
At least a little more reasonable here...

https://weatheryourway.com/products/tropo-4-precipitation-gauge
Wrong. This place charges $11.25 for shipping making it exactly $100 plus tax.
Oh.

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2023, 08:24:09 AM »
I received and installed the new TROPO gauge yesterday. It looks good, and the accessories (brush and hand grip) are nice to have. I like the special features, like the tapered inner cylinder funnel, etc.

It is quite a bit longer and narrower than the original gauge.

I'll order spare outer cylinders and get the gram mass before the snow flies...

Greg H.
Just curious if you left your old coco up to compare readings.

I did not. I reused the same mount and just drilled new holes for the TROPO mount.

I do make comparisons with the Davis and Novalynx gauges. I put the 24 hour amounts at CoCoRaHS observation time in the comments. My ID is MI-PI-1. A comparison prior to the TROPO installation (5/28/2023) for the original gauge could be made vs. newer data.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2023, 08:35:18 AM »
Here is a photo of the new TROPO gauge as installed. This is the old mount reused from the original Stratus gauge.



Greg H.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2023, 08:40:59 AM by miraculon »


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline ocala

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2023, 08:40:35 AM »
I received and installed the new TROPO gauge yesterday. It looks good, and the accessories (brush and hand grip) are nice to have. I like the special features, like the tapered inner cylinder funnel, etc.

It is quite a bit longer and narrower than the original gauge.

I'll order spare outer cylinders and get the gram mass before the snow flies...

Greg H.
Just curious if you left your old coco up to compare readings.

I did not. I reused the same mount and just drilled new holes for the TROPO mount.

I do make comparisons with the Davis and Novalynx gauges. I put the 24 hour amounts at CoCoRaHS observation time in the comments. My ID is MI-PI-1. A comparison prior to the TROPO installation (5/28/2023) for the original gauge could be made vs. newer data.

Greg H.
The only reason I asked is because they say it's more accurate. For $100 I would like to see what those results are. 
The blues had a baby and they named it Rock & Roll

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2023, 08:47:24 AM »
I received and installed the new TROPO gauge yesterday. It looks good, and the accessories (brush and hand grip) are nice to have. I like the special features, like the tapered inner cylinder funnel, etc.

It is quite a bit longer and narrower than the original gauge.

I'll order spare outer cylinders and get the gram mass before the snow flies...

Greg H.
Just curious if you left your old coco up to compare readings.

I did not. I reused the same mount and just drilled new holes for the TROPO mount.

I do make comparisons with the Davis and Novalynx gauges. I put the 24 hour amounts at CoCoRaHS observation time in the comments. My ID is MI-PI-1. A comparison prior to the TROPO installation (5/28/2023) for the original gauge could be made vs. newer data.

Greg H.
The only reason I asked is because they say it's more accurate. For $100 I would like to see what those results are.

I might set the Stratus out on the walkway the next time it looks like rain. Since I reused the mount, this would be the best I can do.

They have this in the CoCoRaHS blog:

Quote
How Accurate is the Tropo Gauge?

The Stratus gauge has a known error of about 2.5 percent (reads 2.5 percent too high). That is within the stated NWS error range of 4 percent from the 8-inch standard rain gauge. The Tropo gauge is accurate to less than 1 percent error. This accuracy is determined by measurement.

The volume of water of a “disc” one inch high and 4 inches in diameter (the outer cylinder) is 205.926 ml (cm3), and it's mass is 205.926 grams. We know there is an error in the Stratus gauge because the volume of water filled to the one inch mark on the inner measuring tube weighs 200.8 grams, not 205.9 grams. A 10-year comparison study of the 4-inch gauge and the NWS 8-inch rain gauge by the Colorado Climate Center found that the 4-inch gauge was higher than the 8-inch gauge by about 3 percent each year. That is consistent with the known accuracy of the Stratus 4-inch gauge.


I Have Both Gauges and the Measurements Rarely Agree.

Even when identical Stratus or Tropo gauges are mounted side by side there will many times be differences in amounts. If all things were equal in an event, the Tropo gauge would be ~0.01" lower at 0.25" in the Stratus, 0.01 to 0.02" lower at 0.50", and 0.03" lower than the Stratus at one inch. So, a measurement difference of a few hundredths between gauges likely has little to do with calibration - it's just a difference caused by any number of things - wind speed and direction, air turbulence around the gauges, rain intensity, etc.

Although the primary field testing has been completed, we are currently continuing field comparisons to not only Stratus PA Gauge, but to the 8" standard rain gauge as well.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Online PaulMy

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 5509
    • KomokaWeather
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2023, 10:35:23 AM »
Thanks Mike/Greg for postings.  I'd be interested but at over $150++ C$ each :(  and I currently have 5 outer tubes for quick replacement and new snow and snow depth measurement in the winter.


I have asked CoCoRaHS Canada if they will be providing this to their Canadian volunteers.  They do offer a good program at $30 C$ for the standard CoCoRaHS gauge.


Enjoy,
Paul

Online PaulMy

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 5509
    • KomokaWeather
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2023, 10:42:31 AM »
Well maybe there is hope...
Got a very quick reply :
Quote
Hi Paul,

That is a great question! I'm glad you're interested in the new gauge.
I'm sure I can get some at some point but I'm currently seeing the new pricing and sourcing them. I will for sure keep you in mind once I'm able to get some stock in!


Have a wonderful day,



xxxxxxxx
National Volunteer Coordinator
CoCoRaHS Canada


Enjoy,
Paul

Offline Cutty Sark Sailor

  • WxElement panel
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 3393
    • Frankfort Weather - TwinHollies WeatherCenter
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2023, 11:21:09 AM »
.....
The only reason I asked is because they say it's more accurate. For $100 I would like to see what those results are. 
My Tests (summarized pdf) here:
You'll note similar readings snow/mixed, using outer cylinder, then as we move into all liquid (±Feb 1) the inner cylinder difference becomes obvious. (NOTE: Without the funnel, the TROPO is approximately 2" lower than Stratus... )
Current Install:

 


Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2023, 02:23:16 PM »
I mounted the old Status gauge on a deck post. Not ideal for a number of reasons, but at least it's a place that I could put it.

I'll put the results in the CoCoRaHS comment for MI-PI-1. (when/if it rains...)

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2023, 08:52:36 AM »
First rain measurement this morning using the TROPO gauge.

The results from my four rain gauges:

Reading from new Climalytic TROPO gauge was 0.08".

Old Stratus=0.09" (relocated to deck)
Davis VP2=0.10"
Novalynx=0.09"

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline WheatonRon

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • WUnderground
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2023, 01:09:14 PM »
First rain measurement this morning using the TROPO gauge.

The results from my four rain gauges:

Reading from new Climalytic TROPO gauge was 0.08".

Old Stratus=0.09" (relocated to deck)
Davis VP2=0.10"
Novalynx=0.09"

Greg H.

In summary, statistically immaterial differences, which is good.
Davis VP2 with SHT31 (3 complete VP2 systems—2 with a daytime fan and 1 that has a 24 hour fan); CWOP--CW5020, FW3075 and FW4350; WU--KILWHEAT17, KILWHEAT36 and KILWHEAT39; WeatherCloud.net; CoCoRaHS--IL-DP-132; and Weatherlink 2.0

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2023, 08:18:53 AM »
Rain readings from overnight:

TROPO gauge = 0.13"
Stratus gauge = 0.14"
Davis TBR=0.14"
Novalynx TBR=0.14"

Wind was very light, calm at times.

There were a lot of droplets clinging to the funnel and inner tube of the TROPO. New plastic might be the explanation.

I suspect that the -0.01" is due to the combined volume of these droplets.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline Cutty Sark Sailor

  • WxElement panel
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 3393
    • Frankfort Weather - TwinHollies WeatherCenter
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2023, 09:01:33 AM »
 I think we need to go back to Stratus... My Tropo is only collecting dust...  Counting today's ETo measure, about 2.5" deficit last 14 days.
Jeremiah 14:22Do any of the worthless idols of the nations bring rain? Do the skies themselves send down showers? No, ...!
 


Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2023, 10:09:09 AM »
I really like the TROPO for several of the features. Not the least of which is the gradations are much more readable in terms of spacing and marking.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2023, 08:50:45 AM »
This morning's rain readings:

TROPO was 0.17"

Stratus gauge had 0.20"

TBR gauges: VP2=0.18"; Novalynx=0.21"

The prior rain event had closer results, so this is probably normal variability. I'm going to contact the Climalytic folks and see if RainX or Plexus is OK on their plastic. There are notably more clinging drops in the TROPO funnel and inner measuring tube.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2023, 09:36:04 AM »
This morning's rain readings:

TROPO was 0.17"

Stratus gauge had 0.20"

TBR gauges: VP2=0.18"; Novalynx=0.21"

The prior rain event had closer results, so this is probably normal variability. I'm going to contact the Climalytic folks and see if RainX or Plexus is OK on their plastic. There are notably more clinging drops in the TROPO funnel and inner measuring tube.

Greg H.

Climalytic responded that they haven't yet tested with RainX, etc. but they intend to experiment.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2023, 08:16:33 AM »
Today's readings:

TROPO=0.09"
Stratus=0.12"

TBR:
Davis=0.11"
Novalynx=0.11"

Response from Climalytic is that the Stratus reads high, which the data supports. I want to try the new plastic-compatible RainX on it to minimize droplets sticking to the funnel and sides. I suspect that some of the rain measurement is lost due to this phenomenon.

I'm going to wait for their test results, since I don't want to make my $100 gauge a "guinea pig" for this experiment.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: New Climalytic TROPO gauge installed
« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2023, 08:25:53 AM »
I am no longer going to post the gauge readings here, but I will continue to show the Stratus readings in my daily comments on CoCoRaHS.

https://www.cocorahs.org/ViewData/ListDailyComments.aspx

Enter MI-PI-1 in the Stations Fields box and tick the Station Number box.

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF