Topic: Barani pro passive shield

[mauro63]

Barani MeteoShield Pro Review.

Automatic translate by Google.

http://www.kwos.it/joomla/en/articoli/144-meteoshield-professional-new

Thanks Raffaello,
great review 

Mauro

[hmderek]

I've been reading up a bit on the Meteo Shield Pro as an alternative to the Davis FARS and/or 7714. I'm having a hard time finding out exactly how a regular Davis SHT31 sensor would be mounted. I see it would involve some trimming, but how it fixed inside the shield afterwards? Or would it just be floating?

[jerryg]

I have cut down a lot of sensors to fit the pro, i use a filter i make to get as much air flow inside the shield as possible, the big filter takes up too much room. You can carefully remove the goop that seals the board and by doing that it will let you fold the cable over and down the middle of the board which i use a tie to hold the cable in place and by carefully trimming the board edge opposite the where the cable solders on being careful not to cut the trace on that side you can slide the shield in the clamp. I use a piece of tubing to drop the cable into with the sensor board sitting on the top and just slide it into the clamp. You can avoid trimming by taking the shield off the mount and inserting the tube in from the top so the width of the board is no problem. I lengthen the cable so i don't have to worry about mounting the shield so the factory cable can reach the iss. I also have made up short cables using cat 5 splices to lengthen the cables so i can put the shield anywhere i want up to around 50 feet from the iss, any more than that the sensor might not work. I believe you can use the davis filter ok by inserting the sensor in from the top. The main thing is to remove the strain material so the cable can be folded over to clear the side of the internal shield. Really the cable length is the main thing because it is not very long. Just depends on how much you feel good about doing but it will fit.

[hmderek]

I have cut down a lot of sensors to fit the pro, i use a filter i make to get as much air flow inside the shield as possible, the big filter takes up too much room. You can carefully remove the goop that seals the board and by doing that it will let you fold the cable over and down the middle of the board which i use a tie to hold the cable in place and by carefully trimming the board edge opposite the where the cable solders on being careful not to cut the trace on that side you can slide the shield in the clamp. I use a piece of tubing to drop the cable into with the sensor board sitting on the top and just slide it into the clamp. You can avoid trimming by taking the shield off the mount and inserting the tube in from the top so the width of the board is no problem. I lengthen the cable so i don't have to worry about mounting the shield so the factory cable can reach the iss. I also have made up short cables using cat 5 splices to lengthen the cables so i can put the shield anywhere i want up to around 50 feet from the iss, any more than that the sensor might not work. I believe you can use the davis filter ok by inserting the sensor in from the top. The main thing is to remove the strain material so the cable can be folded over to clear the side of the internal shield. Really the cable length is the main thing because it is not very long. Just depends on how much you feel good about doing but it will fit.

Thanks Jerry. I noticed I missed some great screenshots around page 13 of part of what you describe. Super useful! You or anyone else happen to have an image of the sf2 filter on top of the Davis sht31 board?

[hmderek]

Received my Meteo Shield Pro from Slovakia earlier this week. Installed it yesterday.

Attempted to reproduce mauro63's sollution for the Davis SHT31 sensor. Ended up cutting slightly into the black wire casing twice  But it works!

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[mauro63]

Received my Meteo Shield Pro from Slovakia earlier this week. Installed it yesterday.

Attempted to reprocude mauro63's sollution for the Davis SHT31 sensor. Ended up cutting slightly into the black wire casing twice  But it works!

My compliments for the choice and for the job

only a question about the solar radiation shields exposure, it seems that the Davis and the Meteoshield is exposed to North, it's better to rotate them to South 


Mauro

[hmderek]

only a question about the solar radiation shields exposure, it seems that the Davis and the Meteoshield is exposed to North, it's better to rotate them to South 


Mauro

I figured I point the 7714 and the Barani North, thinking to prevent windflow from being blocked by the rain collector. Not sure if that even makes sense. What's the thinking about it being better to have the shields point South? Easily fixed of couse.

[mauro63]

only a question about the solar radiation shields exposure, it seems that the Davis and the Meteoshield is exposed to North, it's better to rotate them to South 


Mauro

I figured I point the 7714 and the Barani North, thinking to prevent windflow from being blocked by the rain collector. Not sure if that even makes sense. What's the thinking about it being better to have the shields point South? Easily fixed of couse.

the exposure need to be to South due to do not have shadows from the pole, the brackets, and other equipment during the sun hours
the shadows can alterate temperature readings

Mauro

[Jorginho]

I  read the paper on this station  by the Belgian KMI and it looked good. However; there is a much more thorough research done by the KNMI and I also think one that was deployed in Algeria since radiation errors (I guess) run havoc in the desert over there. An abundance of stations was tested there. The Davis 7714 did well btw, but there were others I think that performed may be even better (I did not reread it and last time I did was in 2014 or so).
I would be really keen  to know how it works compared to more than  just a Davis, a Stevenson  Screen  and a Young aspirated one (of which we know it gets a wetbulb once it rains with  all the aspiration  going on). Especially compared to other nonventilated screens it would be interesting to see what the hellical shape does for the radiation errors.

Thx!

[raffaello.dimartino]

I do not have a RM-YOUNG ventilated but an Apogee ventilated. It doesn't suffer the wet bulb problem because the fan is shut off or blow at low speed when it rains.
You can see the comparison with other solar shields here:
http://www.kwos.org/comparison/

It is an always on comparison.



Inviato dal mio Mi Note 10 utilizzando Tapatalk

[johnd]

I've seen a well-conducted year-long (I think) comparison of the Barani Pro against an RM Young Aspirated, Campbell Met21 and Metspec standard Stevenson screen, but it's not my data so sorry but I can't really share the detail. I think the Barani was roughly on a par with the Met21, though unsurprisingly the aspirated screen was maybe 0.3C cooler on average in summer daytimes

[Jorginho]

Seems that is the comparison done in Humain, Belgium...What I am missing is this: what is the reference screen. So the better you are means the closer you  are to the reference screen. Not necessarily the lower temp under high radiation or things like that. At least not to me. I want to be able for instance to compare to KNMI stations. My station is completely out in the field, just grassland. So that qualifies and so I want to be eradicate everything that affects the readings in a way that makes it deviate from the reference. But that is just me and just that perspective. Of course eradicating radiation errors as much as possible is the way to go if you want correct data.

But it is also fun to do it yourself and I can do that. I have a couple of screens and I can esily mount another one to intercompare. We'll see

thx John and Rafaello for your replies!

[johnd]

Seems that is the comparison done in Humain, Belgium...

The trial I've seen was done in the UK.

[Jorginho]

Oh...that is interesting. I will see if I can  find it. Thx!

[johnd]

Oh...that is interesting. I will see if I can  find it. Thx!

AFAIK it's not published anywhere (though I could be wrong) - it was a private communication. .

[Jorginho]

May  be I'll figure it out myself. But 250 euro for just a screen (if I am correct) seems an awful lot just to test it. 

[hmderek]

May  be I'll figure it out myself. But 250 euro for just a screen (if I am correct) seems an awful lot just to test it.

Maybe you've already seen it, but if not there are also some interesting charts other forum members have shared earlier this year a couple of pages up in this topic.

[ivano]

https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=39934.0
if you want to see comparisons of the barani pro with other screens, visit this thread 

[hmderek]

Have the Meteo Shield Pro for a few days now, alongside the 7714 and standard VP2 shield. Been looking at the graphs for yesterday and today. While I noticed that yesterday the 7714 and Barani kept mostly in sync, with at best 1 or 2 tenths of a degree between them, today seems to be a very different day. It's a bit warmer, slightly lower winds and possibly overall more sun.

This is yesterday through the night into today. While the 7714 somehow dropped lower than the Barani during the night, the situation is completely reversed during the day.
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This is today:
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I'm surprised at how big the difference is. At times, the 7714 is as much as 1,3 degrees C higher, with the default VP2 shield apparently in between. In general, the Barani temps are very much in line with the nearest official station.

Winds are SE, only thing I can imagine is that the 7714 suffers some blockage of air flow due to the rain collector.
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[ivano]

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Have the Meteo Shield Pro for a few days now, alongside the 7714 and standard VP2 shield. Been looking at the graphs for yesterday and today. While I noticed that yesterday the 7714 and Barani kept mostly in sync, with at best 1 or 2 tenths of a degree between them, today seems to be a very different day. It's a bit warmer, slightly lower winds and possibly overall more sun.

This is yesterday through the night into today. While the 7714 somehow dropped lower than the Barani during the night, the situation is completely reversed during the day.
 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

This is today:
 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

I'm surprised at how big the difference is. At times, the 7714 is as much as 1,3 degrees C higher, with the default VP2 shield apparently in between. In general, the Barani temps are very much in line with the nearest official station.

Winds are SE, only thing I can imagine is that the 7714 suffers some blockage of air flow due to the rain collector.
 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

looking at the photo, and I can also be wrong, it seems to me that the pro and davis are oriented to the north and the vp2 to the south, in my opinion you should put all three screens facing south to avoid shading, as they are all undergo shadows, but especially the vp2, if I'm wrong, the better, then I wanted to ask you what sensors you have inside? the standard ecowitt sensors? can? or with the probe? i new wh EP .... i am also carrying out some tests using the meteoshield pro and other screens, including the davis, but they are all with wh31 / 32 EP probe sensors i also put the link above,  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  this is on the roof and includes a meteoshield pro a lastem and a rotronic all with ecowitt probe sensor
 this is the position on the ground at 2.05 meters, meteoshield pro and davis 7714 both with wh32 / 31 EP probe all screens are oriented to the south to avoid shading ,

[hmderek]

looking at the photo, and I can also be wrong, it seems to me that the pro and davis are oriented to the north and the vp2 to the south, in my opinion you should put all three screens facing south to avoid shading, as they are all undergo shadows, but especially the vp2, if I'm wrong, the better, then I wanted to ask you what sensors you have inside? the standard ecowitt sensors? can? or with the probe? i new wh EP .... i am also carrying out some tests using the meteoshield pro and other screens, including the davis, but they are all with wh31 / 32 EP probe sensors i also put the link above,  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  this is on the roof and includes a meteoshield pro a lastem and a rotronic all with ecowitt probe sensor
 this is the position on the ground at 2.05 meters, meteoshield pro and davis 7714 both with wh32 / 31 EP probe all screens are oriented to the south to avoid shading ,

Yes you are right. I will be flipping them both to the South. The argument against the shading makes sense.

All 3 shields have the the standard Davis SHT31 sensor.

Will be checking out the topic you mentioned. Will try out some translation tool to read what you are saying. ^_^ But I see that it looks like you have similar experiences with the Meteoshield Pro.

[Jorginho]

Hi first of all to all that have posted here: thanks so much for all the comparisons. So interesting.

I have done similar things a decade ago (even a bit more). I took saucers that were black and painted the outer parts bright shiny white. The saucers themselves were HDPE matt black so little to do there. I built two. In one I mounted a Tinytag Ultra2 datalogger with calibration certificate and in  the other a Davis sensor. The problem with these thermohygrosensors, to me, is that you cannot easily calibrate it. With probes you can use melting ice and say a 10 liter coolbox and fill it with water of 20 and 40 C (for example) and then put the probe in it together with the datalogger and measure both to get a very good indication of the deviations of the probes and then proceed in  the field. With an SHT31/35 or whatever you use it is more difficult or timeconsuming.

I  ended up putting the Davis sensor in  the Vaisala copy I made back then (I had space enough to do that). The saucer were 21 cm across. The cilinder inside was about 7 cm in diametreand about 15 cm high. So no problem there. And so I could directly compare after all.

I already  have a Vantage Pro2 painted black but never used it. I probably will do so for fun shortly. It is the passive version.

I wonder since Bairani said that painting black made such a difference to the non-Pro version which  essentially performed very alike the 7714 according to them, why not paint you screens mattblack too (your Davis screens). Seems there is a pretty good chance that it will have a discernable effect? We can buy these Davis screens for 40-50 euro or so. If you would achieve something very close to the  Bairani that would be huge saving of money. As nice and exotic I 'd say the Bairani look, 250 euro is quite a lot of money I think surely to 40 euro plus some paint.

[ivano]

Hi first of all to all that have posted here: thanks so much for all the comparisons. So interesting.

I have done similar things a decade ago (even a bit more). I took saucers that were black and painted the outer parts bright shiny white. The saucers themselves were HDPE matt black so little to do there. I built two. In one I mounted a Tinytag Ultra2 datalogger with calibration certificate and in  the other a Davis sensor. The problem with these thermohygrosensors, to me, is that you cannot easily calibrate it. With probes you can use melting ice and say a 10 liter coolbox and fill it with water of 20 and 40 C (for example) and then put the probe in it together with the datalogger and measure both to get a very good indication of the deviations of the probes and then proceed in  the field. With an SHT31/35 or whatever you use it is more difficult or timeconsuming.

I  ended up putting the Davis sensor in  the Vaisala copy I made back then (I had space enough to do that). The saucer were 21 cm across. The cilinder inside was about 7 cm in diametreand about 15 cm high. So no problem there. And so I could directly compare after all.

I already  have a Vantage Pro2 painted black but never used it. I probably will do so for fun shortly. It is the passive version.

I wonder since Bairani said that painting black made such a difference to the non-Pro version which  essentially performed very alike the 7714 according to them, why not paint you screens mattblack too (your Davis screens). Seems there is a pretty good chance that it will have a discernable effect? We can buy these Davis screens for 40-50 euro or so. If you would achieve something very close to the  Bairani that would be huge saving of money. As nice and exotic I 'd say the Bairani look, 250 euro is quite a lot of money I think surely to 40 euro plus some paint.

hello, the barani is not only the internal color of black, but also its helical shape that channels the wind, we can say that it is almost a ventilated one ,,, I have tested some screens, even now I have 3 screens in test all passive but the results are obvious, lower than the pro some of a lot too, the davis 7714 if used with the standard sensor the box ones is a disaster, it takes more than 1 degree from the met pro, instead using it with the probe sensor wh31 / 32 EP is much better, painting the bottom plates black, it doesn't always work, I'll try soon, then the davis 7714 which costs 40 uero ???? where is it ? I paid 110 euros for it

[Jorginho]

Hi. I know very well it is said to be the shape. But has there been any research on both the claim and the  total effect? If it is the Helical shape, than why did the former version which if I am correct was helical too not performing significantly different to the 7714 Davis? I am very critical of it and personally I actually think I like the Barani system a lot. But as of now I am least interested in the shield of all things actually because you can get a very good performing screen for 40 euro's. You can make it yourself functioning even better with some effort for 20 euro. I did. It performs on par with KNMI Vaisala screens which are also black inside btw. Something really has to a whole lot better if it is to cost 250 euro. I feel I am sceptical that a very exotic looking shape with a good story behind it could be setting me back 250 euro where in fact it is simply the black innards that are responsible for 90% of the difference.
I have not found any research that provides a clear indication as what does what but I also did not look hard to be honest. I think if I want to buy a Barani complete setup it has to be ordered with the Pro shield so I'll probably will get it anyway.

I would in all likelihood still end up with the Vaisala screen anyways because to me it is much more important to compare with KNMI  stations, which is a reason tha t even though I have an aspirated Davis screen in my attick I never used it. Why would I deviate from what our Metoffice uses if comparing with those stations is my goal? So suppose I get the Meteoshield pro nothing stops me from comparing it under high radiation situations (in juni of next year I suppose) say from 1-21 june and do the same thing when I painted it white fro 22 june to say the 13 th of July or so. It might give us an indication.

As to the Davis 7714. Sure it costs 110 euro but is there a reason why not to buy this one from the Davis, the passive one for the Vantage Pro2? Paint it black inside and not just the lower plates. From what I know you simply do not want any reflections landing on your sensor. So every plate needs to be black inside. I did it and found it easy to do, but may be I am being oversimplistic here. That could be true.

https://www.wetterladen.de/davis-schutzgehaeuse-6828-fuer-thermo-hygrosensoren?c=1140

[hmderek]

What kind of paint would you use to paint the inside black?