WXforum.net
Weather Station Hardware => Blitzortung => Topic started by: miraculon on July 21, 2013, 04:52:04 PM
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I just sent the PayPal funds to Egon. I did not order the ferrite antennas since I am building up the loop antennas.
Need to order the ST board, cases, GPS, etc.
Greg H
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Good luck, let us know how things progress.
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My System Red is at the USPS. Will pickup tomorrow during lunch. Almost have all of the parts needed to commence. Need to go to Lowe's and get a sheet of foam insulation, then I'll be set. Will not be in a hurry to assemble. Gonna take my time, as it has been several years since I've soldered anything.
John
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John,
What did you do for the GPS antenna? I ordered the Sparkfun GPS Antenna https://www.sparkfun.com/products/177 (https://www.sparkfun.com/products/177). I'll probably make the same PVC housing I did for the other one.
I was also thinking about this: http://www.amazon.com/Tram-Marine-Gps-Antenna/dp/B001DN2KTC/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=2NAFMC77VIK6&coliid=I1D509N6TBULDB (http://www.amazon.com/Tram-Marine-Gps-Antenna/dp/B001DN2KTC/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=2NAFMC77VIK6&coliid=I1D509N6TBULDB) as a possibility.
I am not sure about how much antenna gain is needed to work with the GPS module.
I ordered the STM32F4DISCOVERY board from Mouser.
What did you wind up doing for the boxes? I am thinking about a clear lid for the antenna box so I can see the LEDs.
Greg H
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Hi Greg,
I went with the GlobalSat AT-65SMA GPS antenna that Egon recommended. Do you have pics of the housing you made for your GPS antenna? Got the discovery board from Mouser, also. I kept the boxes I had ordered (same BUD boxes you ordered) for the original system. I believe they are large enough.
On mounting the boards in the boxes, I am going to use some extra motherboard standoffs I have from previous computer builds with a cardboard washer in between the standoff and the board.
John
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My System Red is at the USPS. Will pickup tomorrow during lunch. Almost have all of the parts needed to commence. Need to go to Lowe's and get a sheet of foam insulation, then I'll be set. Will not be in a hurry to assemble. Gonna take my time, as it has been several years since I've soldered anything.
John
I know how you feel, enough empathy that I'm gonna hold off on the 'big' antenna till I prove I can handle the kit's ferrites. Assuming the SMD placement skills are halfway intact, and the circuitry works.
Retired from electronic tech career 1997. Heated up soldering pen 6 times since then.
Finally found it. (Ya' know, gotta get stuff ready).
Cleaned it, put in a new mini-tip, plugged it in, determined which end got hot, let it cool off, and dugout an old spool of 24 gauge solder and a bit of wick, and the solder sucker, the contact cleaner (just in case) and pencil eraser, 2 spools of 26 gauge magnet wire (about a half-mile's worth) I'd never used, aluminum tape (to have nearby if I build the big antenna), couple sheets of copper shielding, some clips, an anti-static mat and ground strap, a third hand, the magnifying glass, two hi intensity lamps, tweezers and the micro tools. New Batteries in the old Simpson and cleaned and checked it, along with the DVM.
I'm ready.
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Do you have pics of the housing you made for your GPS antenna?
http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=18743.msg181195#msg181195 (http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=18743.msg181195#msg181195)
A hint for the surface-mount op amps:
On the amplifier board the SOIC8 op amps shouldn't be too difficult to solder. What I do is to flow solder onto the 8 pads first. Then position the part using tweezers. I solder opposite corners (say 8 & 4) to hold it in place. Then I go around and reflow the remaining leads/pads. SMD parts are meant to be placed into solder paste (microscopic solder balls in resin) and run through a reflow oven. What we are going to be doing is more like a "rework" procedure with a soldering iron. The trick is locating the part since there are no through holes to guide it and you are relying on positioning it and hoping that the surface tension of the solder holds it in place. I have done a number of these parts at work, but SOIC-8 is the smallest that I am comfortable with. (smaller pitch parts would go off to the techs...)
If any of the electronic techs on WxForum have better advice, or a better method please give some pointers.
Greg H
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Do you have pics of the housing you made for your GPS antenna?
http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=18743.msg181195#msg181195 (http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=18743.msg181195#msg181195)
A hint for the surface-mount op amps:
On the amplifier board the SOIC8 op amps shouldn't be too difficult to solder. What I do is to flow solder onto the 8 pads first. Then position the part using tweezers. I solder opposite corners (say 8 & 4) to hold it in place. Then I go around and reflow the remaining leads/pads. SMD parts are meant to be placed into solder paste (microscopic solder balls in resin) and run through a reflow oven. What we are going to be doing is more like a "rework" procedure with a soldering iron. The trick is locating the part since there are no through holes to guide it and you are relying on positioning it and hoping that the surface tension of the solder holds it in place. I have done a number of these parts at work, but SOIC-8 is the smallest that I am comfortable with. (smaller pitch parts would go off to the techs...)
If any of the electronic techs on WxForum have better advice, or a better method please give some pointers.
Greg H
The major mistakes I learned to avoid were:
1. Too large a solder tip.
2. Excessive solder.
3. Large gauge solder is cumbersome at best, and dangerous to your sanity working with these devices. I used 24-30 gauge.
3. Getting the device pins bent so they don't all lie perfectly flat on the pads. That is crucial to a quick safe job!
The procedure I normally used was just the slightest solder on one pad, place the device, and holding it firmly just enough downward pressure, lightly touch the very sharp pointed tip to the device pin resting on the pad(not the pad!) you tinned and press down, as the solder melts, quickly removing the iron, and holding the device still until set... only takes a split second. That should lock the device in position, then gently solder the remaining pads. That insures none of the devices pins are bent/sprung, making them a bit more difficult to solder easily. If you need to touch up the first pin, do so, but remember, it will require just a smidgen of solder. I used a tiny steel brush to remove any rosin that may remain between the pins.
EDIT: I forget the neat one: A drop of candle wax on the device body/ wooden pencil eraser or match stick is enough to place, hold, and press small devices in place while this is done
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I received the Teflon coated 20AWG wire tonight. The improved strength and slipperier wire insulation went much better getting it threaded through the flex conduit. There are 9 turns per loop, for a total of 250uH.
Here are some pictures:
The entire assembly:
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002002.JPG)
Top of the loop with crossing of coils:
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002001.JPG)
Breakout of wires. The white shrink tubing was the "start" winding. I chose Red and Green to match the waveform color codes that Blitzortung uses. (I'll try to match them up) My plan is to mount this box onto the amplifier box with matching holes drilled to fit this box pattern.
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002003.JPG)
Detail of cross brace. It is a four way PVC box. This braces the whole works. I didn't glue two of the braces so I can get it up into the rafters in the garage.
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002004.JPG)
Greg H.
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Greg, it looks great!
Is that plastic-coated steel conduit you are using for the loop shields?
The shield material needs to be non-ferromagnetic (a magnet won't stick to it) or it will shield the magnetic as well as the electrical fields. That's why copper and aluminum are common shielding materials for loops. A magnet won't stick to 'em.
Don
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Here's a nice cheap GPS antenna with the required SMA connector. $5.78 delivered.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/161055310046?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
It works great indoors with the controller, tracking almost all the satellites.
The little GPS module on the controller actually has a built-in patch antenna on top! Don't count on it working well indoors or so close to the other electronics on the board. An external antenna is a must!
Don
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Greg, it looks great!
Is that plastic-coated steel conduit you are using for the loop shields?
The shield material needs to be non-ferromagnetic (a magnet won't stick to it) or it will shield the magnetic as well as the electrical fields. That's why copper and aluminum are common shielding materials for loops. A magnet won't stick to 'em.
Don
I completely understand. I verified that it was 100% non-metallic. I even went to the tool area in Home Depot and placed a strong magnet against it before I purchased the NM conduit. All fittings, etc. are PVC. When I cut it, the cross-section was pure plastic, no metal.
I plan on wrapping it with copper tape before I hoist it up into the garage.
I might hook it up to my o-scope and see what it picks up during noise events and storms while I am waiting for my kit to arrive.
Greg H
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Here's a nice cheap GPS antenna with the required SMA connector. $5.78 delivered.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/161055310046?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
It works great indoors with the controller, tracking almost all the satellites.
The little GPS module on the controller actually has a built-in patch antenna on top! Don't count on it working well indoors or so close to the other electronics on the board. An external antenna is a must!
Don
Thanks for the tip. This might be less hassle than the Sparkfun one that I ordered. Knowing that it works is a plus... =D>
Greg H.
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The STM32F4-Discovery board came today from Mouser. Enjoying the blinky LEDs while I wait for my RED kit from Germany...
Greg H.
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Since it seems that the kits have been short the RN1 resistor network, I decided to order some from Mouser.
Has everyone building system REDs been missing RN1?
652-4607X-1LF-1K
MFG Part No:4607X-101-102LF
4607X-101-102LF
Bourns Resistor Networks & Arrays
I think that this part will work.
Greg H.
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ALL of my parts were there, including the amplifier board resistor network that the later shipments seem to be missing. Not one extra or missing piece! My kit was one of the first four shipments to the US.
It seems that they are also leaving out the RJ45 connector for the second amp on recent shipments, as it is rarely used.
Egon mentioned on the European board that he has run out of some parts and is not shipping any more kits for now.
Don
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That should work fine, if the pin spacing is correct. Pin 1 is connected to one side of all the resistors in the pack. The other pins are the other side of each resistor. The component is used to feed 5VDC through a 1K resistor to each of the LEDs on the amp board. The other side is connected to a port on the microcontroller that pulls a pin to ground to light the LED.
Don
Since it seems that the kits have been short the RN1 resistor network, I decided to order some from Mouser.
Has everyone building system REDs been missing RN1?
652-4607X-1LF-1K
MFG Part No:4607X-101-102LF
4607X-101-102LF
Bourns Resistor Networks & Arrays
I think that this part will work.
Greg H.
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I know this works.
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I don't think this is quite right. It will work, but with the effects noted below.
Pin 1 should not have a resistor, but a wire connected to all of the pins on the top of the other resistors. That's how the SIP is wired internally.
The extra resistor at pin 1 will have the effect of changing the brightness of all of the LEDs, depending on how many are lit at the time. This is because the 1K resistor has current for ALL of the LEDs running through it, if wired as in the image. The voltage drop across the first resistor will vary, depending upon how many LEDs are lit. The overall brightness of all the LEDs will also be cut way down.
You need to replace that resistor at pin 1 with a wire.
Don
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Here's the internal wiring of the SIP. Note there is NO resistor on pin 1, but a common connection to the top of the other resistors:
(http://projectmf.homelinux.com/res_pack.jpg)
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You need to replace that resistor at pin 1 with a wire.
A zero ohm jumper could also be used. They (Mouser, et al) sell them in the same size as a quarter watt resistor. It is probably just as easy to bend the lead over into a loop for the 1st resistor, then "sky joint" the other ones to the top lead.
Greg H.
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saw this schematic, and must have grossly misinterpreted it. However, those LEDs don't change brightness!
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The current drawn by the LEDs is so low, it probably doesn't increase the voltage drop across that first resistor enough to notice. If it works, I'd leave it. Those yellow LEDs are never on during normal operation. The danger of damaging the pad on the board might be too great, depending on your soldering iron and skill set.
You might try disconnecting the amp from the controller, pressing the amp reset button, and turning the pot to light the yellow LEDs in binary sequence. You'll be able to see any brightness variation then.
Normally, the power and green LED are on all the time, so no variation due to that resistor would be seen.
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Yeah, the schematic is hard to read!
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Kit came today. I seem to have the RN1 as well.
I also received the box for the controller. (same one as Blitzortung Green and the Eastern Voltage detector builds)
I decided to get this Tram 1655 for a GPS antenna.
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51G2urb0zAL._SL1000_.jpg)
Greg H.
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From Cutty Sark's video, it looks like the LCD display is green.
There are options for amber and blue.
Is everyone getting the green background/lighting display?
Greg H.
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From Cutty Sark's video, it looks like the LCD display is green.
There are options for amber and blue.
Is everyone getting the green background/lighting display?
Greg H.
Yessir, that's green... I think that's default display, :-k I believe you have to request a different one when you order... :?:
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OK, thanks. I just didn't want to misconfigure the jumper.
I got my amplifier board built up tonight. The LEDS flash four times and then respond to the pot like some kind of science project binary counter.
Greg H.
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:lol:
OK, thanks. I just didn't want to misconfigure the jumper.
I got my amplifier board built up tonight. The LEDS flash four times and then respond to the pot like some kind of science project binary counter.
Greg H.
And online, with the controller doing the work, you set the gain right through the interface... that takes away the amp's Purdy lil blinkers. :lol:
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Built up the controller board tonight!
Getting very close, seems that I have lost a 10 Ohm resistor for R51. I'll need to make a Radio Shack run (or the local Electronics store) for one.
Fired it up without the ST daughter board. Managed to get a GPS fix (judging from the LED) after a few minutes. I even tried the Tram antenna and got a fix OK. This was through the window glass inside, so I am sure it is going to work fine. I'll check it with those nice diagnostics once I finish it.
I have the Bud box for the controller already, ETA is tomorrow afternoon on the box for the amplifier. I went a clear box so I can see the gain LEDs from below. The amplifier box will mount to the bottom pull box on the loop antennas.
Still need to finish with the copper tape on the loop antennas for shielding.
I paralleled the input connectors with a resistor resulting in 325 Ohms terminating resistance.
Greg H.
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Greg, I'm curious which boxes you ordered. I just purchased a pair of NEMA boxes from Bud Industries with transparent lids.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005T79SIY/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005T7ASJC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
For the controller case, I planned to mount two extension buttons for the daughter board on the case so I can reset and control the LCD without opening the case.
Don
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I ordered similar boxes.
The one for the antenna board is http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=PN-1338-Cvirtualkey56310000virtualkey563-PN1338C (http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=PN-1338-Cvirtualkey56310000virtualkey563-PN1338C) I cancelled my Amazon order since the ETA was going to be as late as August 23rd. Mouser had one in stock, so I grabbed it.
The controller board will go into: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005UPNE8A/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005UPNE8A/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) This seems to be the same box without the mounting flanges. I just reordered the same boxes as I used previously, but I could have gotten the one without the flanges like yours.
Greg H.
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Built up the controller board tonight!
Getting very close, seems that I have lost a 10 Ohm resistor for R51. I'll need to make a Radio Shack run (or the local Electronics store) for one.
Fired it up without the ST daughter board. Managed to get a GPS fix (judging from the LED) after a few minutes. I even tried the Tram antenna and got a fix OK. This was through the window glass inside, so I am sure it is going to work fine. I'll check it with those nice diagnostics once I finish it.
I have the Bud box for the controller already, ETA is tomorrow afternoon on the box for the amplifier. I went a clear box so I can see the gain LEDs from below. The amplifier box will mount to the bottom pull box on the loop antennas.
Still need to finish with the copper tape on the loop antennas for shielding.
I paralleled the input connectors with a resistor resulting in 325 Ohms terminating resistance.
Greg H.
Arrgh! ](*,)
It was getting late last night and I forgot all about the 100uF caps needing to be laid down. They are vertical and will hit the ST board.
Since the leads are now cut off, I am going to have to get new ones. I have to get the 10 Ohm resistor anyways...
Greg H.
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Arrgh! ](*,)
It was getting late last night and I forgot all about the 100uF caps needing to be laid down. They are vertical and will hit the ST board.
Since the leads are now cut off, I am going to have to get new ones. I have to get the 10 Ohm resistor anyways...
Greg H.
Can't you file 'em down??? :twisted:
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Arrgh! ](*,)
It was getting late last night and I forgot all about the 100uF caps needing to be laid down. They are vertical and will hit the ST board.
Since the leads are now cut off, I am going to have to get new ones. I have to get the 10 Ohm resistor anyways...
Greg H.
Can't you file 'em down??? :twisted:
It seems to let the magic electrolyte juice out... #-o
Greg H.
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Got the replacement caps, 10 Ohm resistor. Gave it the old smoke test.
I am also seeing crazy high noise, especially with the default 10x10 gain. I reset it to 2x1 and put the thresholds to +/-350mV.
This was just a lash-up in the kitchen to see if it all works. It does.
Now to finish the copper tape on the loop antennas, mount the boards in their respective boxes (antenna amp will be tomorrow probably), etc.
The RED will be station #706, my "green" one is #668. Once I get this all installed, it will be interesting to see how it responds to my "bad neighbor" noise (wherever he is) :x and how the adjustable gains/thresholds deal with that.
I hope to get it fully operating some time this weekend.
Greg H.
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You're may have something like 82KHz, or 82MHz showing on live signals... or some weird AC signal... never could figure out exactly what freg, didn't really care. But its coming from proximity to computers!... Drove me crazy for awhile...
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I do see a sine wave that is always present. I think that the sine wave is the culprit. Adjusting the gain/threshold gets it out of interference mode.
I have it up in the back bedroom rigged up for the night.
I plan on permanently installing it tomorrow (Sat).
That Tram GPS antenna works really well. Although I got a fix yesterday with it, tonight in the back BR I could not get a fix with the small patch antenna (remote). I hooked up the Tram and I had a fix in under a minute. This is INSIDE.
Once I get it installed outside it will work well I think. Now to find some room on my weather mast... :-k
Greg H.
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Here are some pics of the amplifier enclosure being mounted on the antenna assembly.
I completed the Cu foil tape wrapping of the NM conduit. The black wires are to ground the shield.
Here is the NEMA box mounted on the octagonal box. The amplifier board has not been installed yet, but the location has been determined.
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002005.JPG)
Side view of the same, showing how the amplifier NEMA box mounts. This is upside-down in this photo, when it is installed it will be facing down with the clear cover showing the LED status.
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002006.JPG)
And here is the amplifier board as installed.
(http://www.miraculon.net/blitzortung/IM002007.JPG)
I'll try to get photos of the controller box and installation later this weekend.
Greg H.
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Is it wrong that I consider that a work of art? =D>
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Is it wrong that I consider that a work of art? =D>
Well, I consider it a work of art... so two of us can't be wrong. Wait... Greg does also.. 3 of us can't be wrong.
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Is it wrong that I consider that a work of art? =D>
Well, I consider it a work of art... so two of us can't be wrong. Wait... Greg does also.. 3 of us can't be wrong.
Art, whoever that is, had nothing to do with it. I built it all by myself. :lol:
Greg H.
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Is it wrong that I consider that a work of art? =D>
Well, I consider it a work of art... so two of us can't be wrong. Wait... Greg does also.. 3 of us can't be wrong.
Art, whoever that is, had nothing to do with it. I built it all by myself. :lol:
Greg H.
Ah! ...and, Remember, Grasshopper: "A real Master, by their very nature, must require all the credit. It behooves each of us to acknowledge such, so that we may benefit from their wisdom and experience when our own expression lacks inspiration, or technique."
I humbly apologize for inadvertently crediting Art as the source of such wonderment... This is Truly the Creation of a Gregist, 'tis.
And therefore, it is a work of..Quickly, Grasshopper... I am in need of coffee this morning......
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Art, whoever that is, had nothing to do with it. I built it all by myself. :lol:
Greg H.
Silly people, THIS is Art:
(http://content6.flixster.com/question/66/48/39/6648396_std.jpg)
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With all this wrapping with metallic tape and spraying foam board to afix Aluminum Foil (aka TinFoil from the kitchen), one wonders how much insulative effect or increase in resistance adhesive gives? Will there be enough point to point contact with the overlapping wraps that the adhesive won't do the unsuspecting insulation effect?
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With all this wrapping with metallic tape and spraying foam board to afix Aluminum Foil (aka TinFoil from the kitchen), one wonders how much insulative effect or increase in resistance adhesive gives? Will there be enough point to point contact with the overlapping wraps that the adhesive won't do the unsuspecting insulation effect?
Absolutely. Even though it is "conductive adhesive", the overlapping armadillo effect was adding up to several ohms. If you look closely, you can see that I soldered each overlap. The resistance from end-to-end is almost as good as shorting the DMM leads together. 0.2 Ohms or so.
Greg H.
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With all this wrapping with metallic tape and spraying foam board to afix Aluminum Foil (aka TinFoil from the kitchen), one wonders how much insulative effect or increase in resistance adhesive gives? Will there be enough point to point contact with the overlapping wraps that the adhesive won't do the unsuspecting insulation effect?
The foam pieces likely don't have real aluminum covering them, it's probably a mylar. Make sure your adhesive doesn't have acetone in it. The foam slabs are covered to form an E shield allowing only magnetic field reception. If in doubt about conductivity, strap a wire across it. Don't use regular Reynolds Wrap. Use the heavy duty, or the Extra heavy duty if you can find it.
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I finally got it all installed today. The GPS antenna is on the Wx mast just above the H-B lightning detector arm. That went OK. The loop antennas are now hanging in the garage rafters at the far end away from the house. This seems to have paid off, I was able to increase the gain to 10x2 (x40) for a total gain of 800. It is staying out of interference mode and my "efficiency" is increasing, topping my old "6.8 USB" system. (green board)
I wish I had checked the 30' CAT5 STP cable when it arrived. Turns out it was bad and I got errors about the amplifier being disconnected. Sure enough, the gain LEDs were on the potentiometer setting mode, not remote. I thought that I had identified the end with the bad crimp (I did), but my tester showed my re-crimp was bad too. Then I checked known good cables and it said that the same pair was open. I chucked out my last CAT5 tester when it sent me on a "wild goose chase", I think that this one is going to join it in the trash can. I just love "double problems". ](*,)
I'll try to upload some pics when I get a chance.
Greg H.
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With all this wrapping with metallic tape and spraying foam board to afix Aluminum Foil (aka TinFoil from the kitchen), one wonders how much insulative effect or increase in resistance adhesive gives? Will there be enough point to point contact with the overlapping wraps that the adhesive won't do the unsuspecting insulation effect?
The foam pieces likely don't have real aluminum covering them, it's probably a mylar. Make sure your adhesive doesn't have acetone in it. The foam slabs are covered to form an E shield allowing only magnetic field reception. If in doubt about conductivity, strap a wire across it. Don't use regular Reynolds Wrap. Use the heavy duty, or the Extra heavy duty if you can find it.
Sorry, I thought that this was about my copper covered loops. :oops: (sounds like a breakfast cereal)
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:oops: Maybe it was! I just assumed the flat panel build... guess I'm following too many threads... sorry ](*,)
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I finally got it all installed today. The GPS antenna is on the Wx mast just above the H-B lightning detector arm. That went OK. The loop antennas are now hanging in the garage rafters at the far end away from the house. This seems to have paid off, I was able to increase the gain to 10x2 (x40) for a total gain of 800. It is staying out of interference mode and my "efficiency" is increasing, topping my old "6.8 USB" system. (green board)
I wish I had checked the 30' CAT5 STP cable when it arrived. Turns out it was bad and I got errors about the amplifier being disconnected. Sure enough, the gain LEDs were on the potentiometer setting mode, not remote. I thought that I had identified the end with the bad crimp (I did), but my tester showed my re-crimp was bad too. Then I checked known good cables and it said that the same pair was open. I chucked out my last CAT5 tester when it sent me on a "wild goose chase", I think that this one is going to join it in the trash can. I just love "double problems". ](*,)
Greg H.
Yeah Greg =D> Saw you come on this morning, and slowly climb the charts,.... Thor's HSJ has been messing with most of us today, IMO... lotsa storms in line behind each other and stations... .
Observing some of the frustrations you guys have had with tools/equipment, it's hard to believe my 30 year old, and up, tools functioned as they used to, and I expected...