Author Topic: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?  (Read 3356 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online Rover1822

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1989
    • Mini Wind and Solar Data project
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2022, 09:47:49 AM »
Quote
I think filling with water and freezing may bend axels and throw rain data off.

There are small holes in bottom , water should drain and not collect. I mean, with proper maintenance

Ambient:
  WS-2000
  PM 2.5(2)
  WH31B(2)
  WH40E
  WH31P
EcoWitt:
  GW1100
  GW1000(4)
  WH31(2)
  WH57
  WH51(12),
  WH40
  WH5360B
  WN34S
  WittBoy WS90 + GW2000
  WS90 (other one) + GW1100
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #26 on: January 29, 2022, 10:06:28 AM »
Its not hard to happen, obviously. My base was perfectly clear and the freezing rain event stopped it. The outlet of the cone was clear very soon once rain started at above zero but tipper never started for many hours.

Probably lots of units get snow/slushy  combos in there just before full freeze up.

Online Rover1822

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1989
    • Mini Wind and Solar Data project
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #27 on: January 29, 2022, 10:25:07 AM »
Ahh, perhaps. I'm not real fond of the small holes at the bottom of the unit, I get a lot of tree pollen / debris which could clog them.

I don't get your weather, I do get some snow, but usually melts in 24hrs, which is funny as when it melts, usually on a sunny day, I'm reporting rain.

It would take quite a bit to freeze the bucket in place. or do damage IMHO.
Ambient:
  WS-2000
  PM 2.5(2)
  WH31B(2)
  WH40E
  WH31P
EcoWitt:
  GW1100
  GW1000(4)
  WH31(2)
  WH57
  WH51(12),
  WH40
  WH5360B
  WN34S
  WittBoy WS90 + GW2000
  WS90 (other one) + GW1100
Personal Sites: Weather Cam

Offline Bashy

  • brecklandweather.com/meteo
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • brecklandweather.com/index.php
    • Breckland Weather
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #28 on: January 29, 2022, 10:50:43 AM »
Ahh, perhaps. I'm not real fond of the small holes at the bottom of the unit, I get a lot of tree pollen / debris which could clog them.

I don't get your weather, I do get some snow, but usually melts in 24hrs, which is funny as when it melts, usually on a sunny day, I'm reporting rain.

It would take quite a bit to freeze the bucket in place. or do damage IMHO.


Our weather is pants, i swear there is a dome over my area when snow arrives, anyhoo, if ya using weather display software, there is a option to set the rain to snow melt (heated bucket) :)
Kind regards
Bashy

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #29 on: January 29, 2022, 11:02:26 AM »
Ahh, perhaps. I'm not real fond of the small holes at the bottom of the unit, I get a lot of tree pollen / debris which could clog them.

I don't get your weather, I do get some snow, but usually melts in 24hrs, which is funny as when it melts, usually on a sunny day, I'm reporting rain.

It would take quite a bit to freeze the bucket in place. or do damage IMHO.

I wondered if the drains were frozen earlier which caused the issue but were opened when I checked since it warmed up but inside was still frozen.

I will be cutting the grill out for winter and making one to install during summer for bugs.

Offline Bashy

  • brecklandweather.com/meteo
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • brecklandweather.com/index.php
    • Breckland Weather
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #30 on: January 29, 2022, 11:16:15 AM »
Ahh, perhaps. I'm not real fond of the small holes at the bottom of the unit, I get a lot of tree pollen / debris which could clog them.

I don't get your weather, I do get some snow, but usually melts in 24hrs, which is funny as when it melts, usually on a sunny day, I'm reporting rain.

It would take quite a bit to freeze the bucket in place. or do damage IMHO.

I wondered if the drains were frozen earlier which caused the issue but were opened when I checked since it warmed up but inside was still frozen.

I will be cutting the grill out for winter and making one to install during summer for bugs.

yeah, that makes sense :)
Kind regards
Bashy

Offline chief-david

  • Educational Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Space Academy for Educators
    • Benilde-St. Margaret's Weather
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #31 on: January 29, 2022, 11:51:42 AM »
Every time I see this thread, my brain reads it as

De-icing a rain gauge with WD-40



You can't phase me-I teach Middle School.
It's not you-It's WU.

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #32 on: January 29, 2022, 02:02:51 PM »
The install actually starts at the junction box to maintain integrity with grommets. [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #33 on: January 29, 2022, 03:16:09 PM »
One wrap at a time to get it snug. [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #34 on: February 02, 2022, 10:36:01 AM »
......

It would take quite a bit to freeze the bucket in place. or do damage IMHO.

While I was out clearing a path to main ISS etc, I removed the cone from the VP1.

This is what happens in winter. See the little stalagmite? That is pushing up on the bottom of the cone and attached to the ice plug in bottom of cone, so easy to bend the axle. Bit of a design flaw really.

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #35 on: February 02, 2022, 10:40:25 AM »
So it's assembled and out on the pole cycling and it melts snow.

I have the distinct idea that it will need a second heater element though. Not very cold today.

In this configuration I have it set to come on at 2 deg C and off and 5 deg.

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
« Last Edit: February 02, 2022, 10:43:23 AM by davidmc36 »

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #36 on: February 03, 2022, 07:42:08 AM »
The far VP2 measured 0.03" after midnight, before the change-over from rain.

The one with heater measures 0.17" right now.

There is about an inch of snow on the railing.

It's only -4 C

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]  [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2022, 07:29:02 AM »
Running along so far since I put it up.

It actually stays on below about -8C. I thought about fiddling with the sensor position and/or set-point but decided to leave as-is for a few weeks as a torture test. It's only an old style cone of which I have a few. We'll see how the silicone holds up. Later on I can put a probe on the collection surface and see what it takes to keep it warm.

I'm pretty sure it will need a second element wrapped in between the current one to have it cycle very much in low temps. If there is no degradation inside then not much worry anyway if it runs somewhat steady. Two elements equals 30 watts. Not cheap though. Maybe 6 or 8 dollars a day running flat out. I probably want to unplug it during long cold, dry spells.

Looking at the outside of the cone in the photo above, it would appear more insulation would improve performance also.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2022, 07:32:23 AM by davidmc36 »

Offline Bashy

  • brecklandweather.com/meteo
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • brecklandweather.com/index.php
    • Breckland Weather
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2022, 07:44:41 AM »
Running along so far since I put it up.

It actually stays on below about -8C. I thought about fiddling with the sensor position and/or set-point but decided to leave as-is for a few weeks as a torture test. It's only an old style cone of which I have a few. We'll see how the silicone holds up. Later on I can put a probe on the collection surface and see what it takes to keep it warm.

I'm pretty sure it will need a second element wrapped in between the current one to have it cycle very much in low temps. If there is no degradation inside then not much worry anyway if it runs somewhat steady. Two elements equals 30 watts. Not cheap though. Maybe 6 or 8 dollars a day running flat out. I probably want to unplug it during long cold, dry spells.

Looking at the outside of the cone in the photo above, it would appear more insulation would improve performance also.

That price a day cannot be right? in dollars for me it would be less than $0.50 a day,
in UK money it would be about £0.14 a day thats on the 19.63p p/kw tarriff, its a little more than that now, just cant be asked to go look lol, deffo no more than £0.30 p/kw. You would need 33.3 hours to use 1 kw and theres no way your tariff is that high, you'll be using cents per day not dollars ;)
Kind regards
Bashy

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2022, 07:47:01 AM »
Yes. Better math. Thanks. :oops:

Offline Bashy

  • brecklandweather.com/meteo
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • brecklandweather.com/index.php
    • Breckland Weather
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2022, 07:50:17 AM »
Yes. Better math. Thanks. :oops:


No worries, i only know cause i have a smart leccy meter, I changed all my lights to LED, including the floodlights, even made sure the TV was LED lol, i am quite cost aware, my cone heater is on 24/7 when its cold enough, costs me next to nothing to run, especially during the daytime as i have solar panels :)
Kind regards
Bashy

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #41 on: February 23, 2022, 05:02:03 PM »
The design seems effective. We had a mix of freezing rain, snow, and ice pellets that left about an inch of frozen crap on the ground. The heated cone registered 0.52". The other two logged 0.19 due to temperature raising to +2c after the event stopped.

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #42 on: March 25, 2022, 03:12:34 PM »
Developed a bit of condensation. Still low humidity though. [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

Offline davidmc36

  • He who dies with the most toys wins!
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1246
  • FN25ie61jw
    • MorewoodW34
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #43 on: May 11, 2022, 07:34:34 AM »
I call it a resounding success for heater where line voltage is available. I have an idea for 12 volt version too.

Basically ran flat out all winter. Not a sign of any deterioration. It's not that hot after all.

I dont think I missed any percip (not that cold this winter) and it never froze the drains. I never modified them.

I will add a second element though as I don't think it could keep up at low temperatures.

All kinds of room to play with setting range and sensor position to fine tune.

It will need periodic attention as I see some schmegma in the outlet of cone that must be be deposited from the melting snow as miniscule particles.

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
« Last Edit: May 11, 2022, 07:37:53 AM by davidmc36 »

Offline tedroche

  • Semi-retired, novice weather station operator
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Weather Observer, CoCoRaHS, Storm Spotter
    • Contoocook Village North
Re: De-icing a WH-40 rain gauge?
« Reply #44 on: May 11, 2022, 09:54:53 AM »
Every time I see this thread, my brain reads it as

De-icing a rain gauge with WD-40

Me, too, and I'm the OP!  :lol: =D> :grin: :roll:
Ecowitt GW1100, HP3501 WH32B WN32BS WH31 WH41 WH40B WS68BN
WeeWx Seasons on Raspian Buster Web site
WU: KNHHOPKI09 CWOP: GW0103 and WOW
CoCoRaHS: NH-MR-68 PWSWeather

 

anything