Topic: Weather Station Selection Advice - Alexa compatibility and in UK

[iamdm]

Hi folks,

been researching for a while and keep coming up on dead ends.... looking for an entry level/mid range PWS (say £2-300), requirements are:

Temp
Windspeed
UV
Decent colour display of current readings
Alexa skill compatibility

The first 3 are pretty common (obviously) but trying to find something that meets the last 2 in the UK is proving very difficult (many of the accurite and ambient weather PWS available in the US tick all boxes easily, just don't seem to be available here??). Really only the Davis professional models seem to fit, but they are outside my budget.

I did try to investigate adding a meteobridge to one of the common PWS which tick all boxes except Alexa compatibility, but it seems either that is expensive or I'm not quite getting how to cheaply interface the two items.

It seems that the changes to WU scuppered my selection of PWS in the UK?

Happy to be educated on a cheap application of a meteobridge or advice on PWS that otherwise meets the bill.

Thanks in advance.
DM

[doubleohwhatever]

Couple of things:

1) Most of the Ambient models are made by Fine Offset and there are several other resellers out there like Ecowitt (ecowitt.com) and Froggit (Froggit.de). You should be able to get any Fine Offset hardware you want.

2) How important is UV accuracy to you? I ask because you mentioned it as your #3 requirement.

[iamdm]

Thanks for the reply.

point 1) has lead me to this interesting thread https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=37805.0 which is informative (I've yet to look into all avenues mentioned, it's a bit old so some links are dead now) - this implies it's actually not that straight forward with the Fine Offset gear. Likewise I've checked out Ecowitt and they are US based, leaving me having to import the PWS (costly).

UV doesn't have to be that accurate, essentially just looking for something better (i.e. more local) than what my phone provides!

[galfert]

Ecowitt is not US based. They are in China and they are very easy to do business with worldwide. To meet your requirements the Ecowitt HP2551 checks almost all your boxes. There are also some other Fine Offset resellers that you may want to look into that also sell the HP2551 clone....Misol, Froggit, Watson, ELV, Steinberg. I'm not up to speed as to which of these are a good option for the UK.

The one challenge is Alexa integration. This is not impossible but as you mentioned you just need to find a way to get your data into a service that can then interact with Alexa. That can be accomplished as you mentioned with the Meteobridge and the additional $100 Ambientweather.net license. But running a Meteobridge with the Ecowitt means that you'll also need the GW1000 (or WH2650) so that the Meteobridge can get data. But there is another way...you can get data from the HP2551 into Ambientweather.net with FOSHKplugin (no GW1000 needed), but this still requires the $100 Ambientweather.net one time license. This last check box throws your budget but I don't know of any other way to accomplish everything in your check list. At least it is not impossible. Maybe Alexa integration is something that you can consider adding later.

[iamdm]

thanks for the response, taken a few days for more reasearch.

Sorry, I'd seen prices in USD and discussions about Ecowitt and importation, so incorrectly assumed USA, but the point still stands regarding the additional costs that their location imparts.

You are right, the HP2551 looks spot on. Is there any way to find out the other 'clone' device part numbers, as although the other brands you mention do throw up many devices, I can't easily, unless doing it visually, correlate these with the HP2551 (which I guess is the original Fine Offset/Ecowitt part number)? (I think the Froggit HP1000SE PRO is the same device, packaged with their sensors?)

It appears that system is fully modular, you can essentially get the screen and attach whatever sensors you fancy, as a sort of hub, if I understand it correctly. I have since found Ecowitt sensors on amazon.co.uk and also this site https://weatherspares.co.uk/collections/ecowitt both selling UK stock - along with the GW1000. However, neither seem to stock the actual HP2551 unit (there's a lightly used one on ebay just now!)

The FOSHKplugin looks interesting, but I don't quite get what you mean about not needing a GW1000 - it looks like I don't need a meteostation and this plugin works directly on the GW1000 (with a license if using ambientweather.net)?

[broadstairs]

Don't forget that WeatherSpares is UK based and now sells Ecowitt weather stations. Having said that I have purchased direct from Ecowitt, yes the lead times are variable between 4 to 6 weeks usually. See https://weatherspares.co.uk/collections/ecowitt. It seems like currently WeatherSpares don't have any consoles but you can always use an old Android tablet as a console to the GW1000 using PWT app (Personal Weather Tablet). At present I believe Froggit do not ship to the UK blaming Brexit!

Stuart

[galfert]

In regards to uploading data to Ambientweather.net for Alexa integration you'll need something to upload to that site. The Ecowitt HP2551 and other FO clones do not upload to Ambientweather.net with the exception of the Ambient branded consoles. Basically if you get a FO clone they all upload to Ecowitt.net instead of to Ambientweather.net. I would not recommend getting an Ambient branded station unless you are in North America because the Ambient stations use 915 MHz. Not to mention that exporting an Ambient branded station is also a warranty nightmare. Also Ambient consoles only work with Ambient branded sensors because of firmware lockdown in Ambient consoles.

This means that you have to find a way to upload to Ambientweather.net from a non-Ambient branded station. There are only two ways that I know that this is possible. The first way is with a Meteobridge and the Ambientweather.net license. But the Meteobridge will not directly connect to the HP2551 so therefore you'll need to also have a GW1000 (or WH2650). The other way is to run FOSHKplugin on a computer (or Raspberry Pi or NAS...etc.) and then also with the Ambientweather.net license. The FOSHKplugin software will get data from the HP2551 without needing the GW1000 / WH2650.

As to which method you choose depends on you. Maybe FOSHKplugin is all you need as that accomplishes the task being discussed (uploading to Ambientweather.net). On the other hand maybe the investment in the Meteobridge gets you other features that you may like.

[iamdm]

Galfert, thanks again.

My reading of this thread: https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=39625.0 suggested that FOSKPlugin actually runs on the GW1000 itself allowing it to parse the data to various servers/websites/services? Or on a linux pc/pi etc.... as you said (I do run a QNAP NAS 24/7, but it's a dated model and I don't really do linux CLI). Or have I misunderstood the first post by the plugin developer?

I'm trying to dig into it, but the wiki really just talks about configuration and different functionality, not the application of the software!

All that said, the GW1000 doesn't seem badly priced (~£63), if it can also perform this functionality, noting that if going the FOSHK route, I'd have to purchase then learn Raspberry PI... (seems the cheapest route there?)

[galfert]

FOSHKplugin does not run on the GW1000. Nothing runs in the GW1000 except for what is already baked into it by the manufacture. The GW1000 and HP2551 allow for you to configure them to send data to different locations and services in different protocols. The GW1000 has one extra method of sending data (or rather to respond to data requests) that the HP2551 does not have. This extra method is simply referred to the local network GW1000 API. The WH2560 also has this exact same GW1000 API capability.

FOSHPlugin is simple a software application designed to receive data from a console or to actually do the GW1000 API data request. This software needs a computer to run on. It is just common or popular to do so on a Raspberry Pi, due to cost, size, power requirements, ease of use, and reliability. But certainly you can run this software on any computer you want as a Raspberry Pi is just what is referred to as a single board computer, but a computer none the less.

True that the GW1000 is not a very expensive investment. But if your plan is to run FOSHKplugin and you already have the HP2551 then this is really not much to benefit from the GW1000 as the HP2551 is just as capable of getting the data to the FOSHKplugin computer. The GW1000 is neat in that it does give you live local data while looking at the WS View mobile app while you are on the local network, something that the HP2551 does not do. So I'm not saying that the GW1000 has no benefit if you are running FOSHKplugin.

It amounts to this. The HP2551 can only send data to some destination (push method). While the GW100 has an API that will respond to any software that talks to it using its API (pull method). The GW1000 can also do the same push method as the HP2551. The FOSKHPlugin software is compatible with both devices, whereas the Meteobridge in regards to newer FO clones only accepts the GW1000 API (pull method).

[iamdm]

thanks for the clarification/explanation.

It looks like my stumbling block for the plugin is the Linux environment required (as much as you say computers, I can only see Linux runtimes and guides available?), although we have several computers in the house, they are all windows boxes and having tried before, I find Linux hard work! Maybe the RPI route is easier, was just trying to avoid having to learn a new OS (got 2 young kids, so time for this stuff is now at a real premium!).

On the PWS front, still tying to find the clones...

There's a Froggit HP1000SE on amazon, which looks like the HP2551:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/froggit-HP1000SE-Including-Internet-Wireless/dp/B098K13VR4/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=HP1000SE+PRO&qid=1625491727&sr=8-3

Likewise, this Aercus unit looks like a clone too, although the sensors look to be own branded (and not up to much...) so not convinced.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wireless-WeatherRanger-Real-time-Internet-Publishing/dp/B00ZVFZRRK/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?dchild=1&keywords=froggit+Wireless+Weather+Station&qid=1625491804&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFRMUpEMlNLVUtKOEomZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA5MzYwMjcyMERPQlhXMDhUR1JJJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA1NzM2NjExNklJREM1UVBKRDJGJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

I assume there is no definitive list from the various resellers mentioned before (Misol, Watson, ELV, Steinberg etc.) so I could track those down?

[broadstairs]

It looks like my stumbling block for the plugin is the Linux environment required (as much as you say computers, I can only see Linux runtimes and guides available?), although we have several computers in the house, they are all windows boxes and having tried before, I find Linux hard work! Maybe the RPI route is easier, was just trying to avoid having to learn a new OS (got 2 young kids, so time for this stuff is now at a real premium!).

About Linux the modern distros are much easier to use than before and any one using the KDE desktop will be very familiar to a Windows user, in fact some years ago I converted my wife's laptop to Linux/KDE and she barely noticed the difference. Yes it still has a console and all the usual commands but these days you can do pretty much every thing in the GUI. Why not download a live distro and put it on a USB stick and boot it from there to play with so you can do it without touching your Windows install, most distros have live versions to boot from a USB stick. Don't ask about peoples favourite distros as you will get as many answers as people! Ubuntu, Fedora, openSUSE (use their Leap not Tumbleweed) are just 3 to look at.

Stuart

[iamdm]

Broadstairs, thanks... but...

although I hear what you are saying, and you can clearly tell my Linux experience is from times gone by.... probably 20yrs ago, when Fedora was new (may still have just been Redhat!), I did dabble with PSUbunto when the PS3 was new, which was my last foray in that world, then they killed it. I think SUSE was the only one I got working reliably, but overall it was just a PITA - haven't tried it since OpenSUSE became a thing.

Appreciate the desktop environment has matured, but I can tell just from the instructions in the wiki and on this forum that the reliance on the CLI is still ever-present - all the installation and update guides are 'sudo' this, 'get' that and while it may all work better (I seem to recall there was a distro where the coder actually commented the next step was to  "sacrifice a goat" because it failed so often, only matched by other commit comments where "I don't know why this works, but don't touch it or it will break and you will burn in hell").

But, that is just me being lazy at the end of the day and the RPI environment may be much better, simply as it's so well supported and there's a lot of interest - my main issue is not having a Linux box to run 24/7, unless I try and break into my NAS (which is tempting....) so would need to be the PI route.

[broadstairs]

Although I have not (yet) tried an RPi I believe it is quite heavily reliant on the command line, I may be wrong but I believe so.

Stuart

[iamdm]

from what I know of it, you can run a desktop environment just as easily as anything (although I think certain physical adapters are needed to attach a screen), but since the FOSHKPlugin stuff is installed via CLI, it's maybe irrelevant if all it's used for is parsing the PWS data... I'm sure one of my mates uses one to run KODI as the front end, another (who is highly technical) has been getting windows 10 to run on it (with mixed success). All fun and games if you've got the time and aspiration!

[galfert]

The Aercus you found is a prior version before the HP2551 and you can tell by the display graphics being totally different. This old model I would not recommend. It's very different in terms of firmware and the outdoor sensor array is not as good as the newer model.

I recommend familiarizing yourself with this chart.
https://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=40730.0

[iamdm]

Galfert,

thanks, that is immensely helpful and it's clear why you've recommended that model over the others...

[iamdm]

folks,

thanks for the input so far, to round off where I've got to -

Managed to find at least 3 'clones' of the HP2551 (and packages) readily available on amazon.co.uk, the other routes (direct with ecowitt etc.) come in at similar price points but introduce the added/risk/time/hassle of "non-local" purchases. The spread of coasts is from £190 to £260, but they seem very similar, just slightly different sensor packages.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/MISOL-Wireless-weather-station-wunderground/dp/B07RQRGH9G/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=misol+hp2550&qid=1625581828&sr=8-2

https://www.amazon.co.uk/froggit-HP1000SE-Including-Internet-Wireless/dp/B098K13VR4/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=HP1000SE+PRO&qid=1625491727&sr=8-3

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Watson-Weather-station-Colour-screen/dp/B08N1B2296/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Watson+W8686&qid=1625581117&sr=8-1

On the subject of getting data to ambientweather.net, to allow alexa integration, I'm left with the 2 options discussed above:

1) buy a rpi, load a linux on it, run FOSHKPlugin
2) buy a rpi or other cheap router (https://www.meteobridge.com/wiki/index.php/Hardware) and flash it with meteobridge firmware, then buy the AWN license ($100)

although option 1) could work out cheaper (by $100 or less), it requires a bit more effort on my part, by way of tinkering and figuring out the RPI OS and linux. Option 2) just needs to get the device flashed (and some of the compatible routers can be had for half the price of a new RPI, if ebay is kind).

Thanks for your input - happy to hear if I've missed anything!

[doubleohwhatever]

On the subject of getting data to ambientweather.net, to allow alexa integration, I'm left with the 2 options discussed above:

1) buy a rpi, load a linux on it, run FOSHKPlugin
2) buy a rpi or other cheap router (https://www.meteobridge.com/wiki/index.php/Hardware) and flash it with meteobridge firmware, then buy the AWN license ($100)

Unless I'm missing something (entirely possible), both options would require a $100 AWN license.

[iamdm]

You know, I think you are right. Kinda leaves me with option 2 and not having to learn Linux CLI again

Thanks.

[doubleohwhatever]

If you're not familiar or comfortable with Linux CLI then yeah, Meteobridge is going to be the most user-friendly solution.

There's something to be said for learning a new skill (Linux CLI, etc) but there's also something to be said for getting the job done as easily as possible and moving on to other projects. Neither is wrong.

[galfert]

Here is some feedback...

- The Meteobridge software requires its own license cost. So be sure to take that into account.

- If considering the Meteobridge, I would highly recommend the RPI version for hardware as the TP-Link hardware has several cons; it has less features, no data archiving, it has noticeably slower UI.

- If you go with Misol then you'll get 433 MHz equipment. If you go Froggit or Watson then you get 868 MHz. Considering Froggit has more optional sensors available, it would give you more types of optional sensors if you go with 868 MHz. Of course you can always order any sensor directly from Ecowitt in any frequency, but you seem to not prefer ordering from Ecowitt due to cost. You can even get the Watson and then add Froggit sensors or vise versa since they are the same frequency.

- The Froggit HP1000SE PRO with separate components is most usually a better option for better sensor placement optimization.

[iamdm]

Thanks again galfert

Took some finding on the meteobridge website, but finally found the cost of the license €65 (strangely similar to the $100 for AWN!).

Noted on the hardware too.