Author Topic: Best CWOP upload program  (Read 4932 times)

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Offline WXMoab

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Best CWOP upload program
« on: December 13, 2009, 12:37:38 AM »
For those who have been at this a while, what do you find is the best way to upload to the CWOP program. Right now I'm using VWS via the VWSaprs app. I'm wondering if VP live is a better option or direct from WL.


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Offline W3DRM

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2009, 01:03:59 AM »
I use VPLive simply because it gives me accurate barometer reports at my altitude of 4801'. Before switching to VPLive I was constantly chasing my barometer readings. VPLive save the day for me.

If your location is anything above 3000' or so, I would highly recommend it.

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Offline WXMoab

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2009, 01:25:09 AM »
I'm at 4540 and have been having QC issues on the barometer but they have been getting better but I'm sure not there yet. I haven't got it all figured out on how to properly calibrate and I'm confused on who I can accurately compare too. I figured the airport but its 22 miles away and doesn't always line up with the closer stations. I also get confused between altimeter and SLP. I'm new so its taking some getting used too.

I just read a bit more about VPlive and it sounds like a good deal. Why does it help those of us over 3000 feet?
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 01:37:03 AM by Mark1974 »


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Offline Weather Display

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2009, 01:46:42 AM »
Quote
Why does it help those of us over 3000 feet?
because it sends the needed corrected barometer value (derived from raw data from the console)

Offline kray1000

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2009, 05:39:22 AM »
I recommend VPLive at any altitude.

Well, maybe not from outer space, but you get the idea.
Kevin Ray
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Offline Mark / Ohio

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2009, 11:04:18 PM »
I recommend VPLive at any altitude.

Well, maybe not from outer space, but you get the idea.

Ditto.  It helped my barometer readings to them and I no longer have to play with the setting with the seasons.  I'm only at approx. 980ft.  In fact it has now been several years since I even touched the barometer adjustment.
Mark 
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Offline WXMoab

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2009, 10:27:15 AM »
So far my barometer readings are improving vastly. I got consistant Q's on the NOAA surface map before but now I'm getting only V's http://www-frd.fsl.noaa.gov/mesonet/?center_lat=38.5300&center_lon=-109.5067&scale=137

On Mesowest I was getting tagged with caution's and OK's alternately but since VP Live its been solid green OK's (had more caution's than OK's. http://mesowest.utah.edu/cgi-bin/droman/meso_base.cgi?stn=D3889 My Gladstone page still looks bad but it needs more time to recover and show a better trend. Its been nothing but red X and thumbs down on the barometer from day one. I did some adjusting against the airport before VP Live and it was getting better but still didn't seem to want to continue to track correctly.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2009, 10:32:18 AM by Mark1974 »


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Offline Anthony

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2009, 08:53:09 AM »
I use the VWS plugin. And speaking QC reports. My baro readings have been skewed ever since getting my internet connection back at the first of the month. I have even reset my sea level pressure on the console. I think my baro sensor may be on the way out the door.



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Offline SlowModem

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2009, 09:11:39 AM »
I use the VWS plugin. And speaking QC reports. My baro readings have been skewed ever since getting my internet connection back at the first of the month. I have even reset my sea level pressure on the console. I think my baro sensor may be on the way out the door.

Perhaps your sensor battery is getting low, but not low enough to get the low battery alarm?
Greg Whitehead
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Offline Anthony

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2009, 03:15:07 PM »
I changed the baro sensor. Now it seems to be running low. As for the batteries. It is indicating a low battery. But it has never caused a problem before.


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Anthony
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Offline Scalphunter

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2009, 03:57:02 PM »
 I get a lot of cautions at mesowest. asked them why and what the problem was . Explained my  maritime climate. From ocean straight up a mountain side.  they cam back and said that there comparator was set up for more like a Kansas  corn field  rather then for my area so I would be seeninng those cautions. It the same with QA from gladstone. No where does it takes in your terrain to mini climates. It is just a general run of the mill. Kinda hard to compare me to a ligth house  90 miles away in middle of the pond with no vegation on it but he does. I really  don't go by CWOP any more. Just use my head and  watch and call local fligth statin  and see what they have.  Way I set this station up.

John

Offline WXMoab

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2009, 11:49:32 AM »
Can anyone tell me the best startup order of my programs? I'm running Startwatch and sometimes VP live says it failed to open the weather link history .wlk file. Right now I have VP live starting after weather link but maybe it should be the other way around? I don't fully understand the archiving method and timing and if this has an affect on this file and VP live starting up.

-Startwatch starts then comes the following

-Virtual VP
-5 sec. after Virtual VP Weather Link
-5 sec. after WL VP Live
-5 sec. after Virtual VP VWS


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Offline Mark / Ohio

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2009, 01:40:04 AM »
.... Right now I have VP live starting after weather link but maybe it should be the other way around? ....

Yes, you want VPLive to start first, set it to run WeatherLink briefly to update the data files, then have WeatherLink itself start up secondly.  I also have VWS starting up third as it takes the longest to get going.  You'll need to play with the delay amounts as that can kind of depend on your computer speed and also how long it has been since the last time you started up.  (Longer down times mean more data  for WeatherLink to load from the logger when VPLive starts it up.)

Here's my current settings (This on an old 466MHz computer with approx 500MB RAM)





I don't think there is any right or wrong way to set this up.  Just whatever works for your setup.  I've had mine different ways in the past but with the programs always starting in the same order.  I'm currently monitoring my internet connection to my website.  So if StartWatch detects that the connection drops it closes the programs and restarts them once the connection comes back up.  Now if it could just reboot my DSL modem once a month or so when it starts to irratate the FTP upload of VWS I think I would be pretty well set.   :-k
« Last Edit: December 18, 2009, 01:44:25 AM by Mark / Ohio »
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Offline WXMoab

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2009, 12:53:59 AM »
Thanks Mark, that was helpful. It took me some time but I finally got it to where I think its working well and I'm no longer getting the wlk file open error. I also got the UPS and computer setup to come back online after an extended power outage (just had an hour long blackout last week). I feel much better knowing that, in theory, things will get back on track if the power goes out when I'm not home.


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Offline tinplate

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2009, 01:52:49 AM »
To answer the question early in the thread as to why VPLive helps folks over 3000 feet...

The Vantage Pro provides only Sea Level Pressure (SLP). This is a derived value that is the result of a calculation that takes the raw sensor pressure, temperature, humidity and elevation. CWOP does not want SLP, it wants Altimeter, which is a different derived value that is calculated using only raw sensor pressure and elevation. Above around 1000 feet SLP and Altimeter don't track well over the full range of temperatures a station might see. So if you're sending SLP to CWOP, and calibrate your barometer to look right, you will see your QC get increasing off as the average temperature changes, such as when a cold front moves through, or from the general changes of the seasons.

When I first wrote VPLive, it was the only program that properly calcuated and sent altimeter to CWOP. Since then, many of the other weather programs added this feature (some of them using the same code that's in VPLive, since I made it freely available to encourage its use so data quality to CWOP would improve). Virtual Weather Station is one of the few programs that still insist on only sending SLP to CWOP for Vantage Pro stations.

Regarding the inconvenient use of WLK files by VPLive at startup, I am currently in the process of making a new version of VPLive that will download archive data directly from the console, and so will not need to run weatherlink at all.

Steve
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Offline DaculaWeather

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2009, 07:40:18 AM »
That will be nice, I never use my WL but it still runs and does it's download thing.

I think for now, I'll keep using the VWSaprs, my baro's been perfect with CWOP but I'm only at 1040 feet. I match the airport that's 5 miles away (and what CWOP is comparing me to).
« Last Edit: December 21, 2009, 07:51:45 AM by DaculaWeather »
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Offline WXMoab

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #16 on: December 21, 2009, 09:52:32 AM »
Thanks for the explanation Steve and for the great programs!


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Offline Cienega32

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2009, 05:33:29 PM »
To answer the question early in the thread as to why VPLive helps folks over 3000 feet...

The Vantage Pro provides only Sea Level Pressure (SLP). This is a derived value that is the result of a calculation that takes the raw sensor pressure, temperature, humidity and elevation. CWOP does not want SLP, it wants Altimeter, which is a different derived value that is calculated using only raw sensor pressure and elevation. Above around 1000 feet SLP and Altimeter don't track well over the full range of temperatures a station might see. So if you're sending SLP to CWOP, and calibrate your barometer to look right, you will see your QC get increasing off as the average temperature changes, such as when a cold front moves through, or from the general changes of the seasons.

Steve
SoftWx

I CWOP with WLink from 4474 feet and have good Q relative to area stations. http://weather.gladstonefamily.net/site/C9386

The thing is more stations are popping up out here lately and the choice seems to be VP2 with WLink (other than the airport 20 miles away at 4455 feet).

My question is if I changed to VPLive, would I suddenly appear to be out of whack? I guess my concern should be with data accuracy for CWOP more so than worrying about my "neighborhood Q", right?

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Offline tinplate

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2009, 12:59:20 AM »
The WeatherLink software program currently sends altimeter, and has for several versions. I don't recall the exact version number where they made that change. So if you're using a relatively recent version of WeatherLink, your barometer data to CWOP should be good, and be the same values as VPLive would send. This is not true for the WeatherLinkIP when you configure CWOP data to be sent by the WeatherLink website though.

Something to note with WL is that it will also send the calculated 24 hour rain value that is the most important one as far as MADIS is concerned, but you need to have the bulletin window open for that to happen (since the 24 hour running total is calculated from the live data).

Steve
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Offline Cienega32

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2009, 01:14:08 AM »
I backtracked from 5.9.x to WLink 5.8.3 so I guess I'm good. I always run in Bulletin mode now thanks to StartWatch's handy feature.

Thanks for all that info!

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Offline WeatherGoose

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Re: Best CWOP upload program
« Reply #20 on: December 24, 2009, 01:32:13 AM »
I guess I'm lucky in that my weather software has all of that built in, so there is no need to go outside the main software for both CWOP and Wunderground communications.  Never have had any issues with BARO or anything else not being right on the money.

I have to agree about the QC stuff with CWOP!  It is really too bad that they don't have a more intelligent way of QCing a particular station.

I too have stopped bothering to care much what my CWOP QC results are. Although they are all green and two thumbs up about 90% of the year,  there are those times when I start getting RED Xs, OUT OF RANGE warnings and CAUTIONS on MESOWest.  My MESOwest QC seemed to improve when MADIS began doing 5 minute samples instead of their previous 15 minute sample intervals.

That was especially helpful for my feed to the NWS and our data broadcast on NWR.  The data broadcast for D2149 would often be off with the "ACTUAL" top of the hour data here before the MADIS change. This was because they would often take a sample a good 30 minutes before the top of the hour, and then say that these were the observations for say 10PM, when in fact, they were actually for 9:30PM.  Now they are sampling at around 9:55PM for the 10PM broadcast update.  The guys at Hanford told me this would be the way the new system would work, and I was very pleased to see it rolled out exactly the way they said it would work! :)

I am wondering if CWOP is ever going to tell station owners that MADIS is sampling every 5 minutes?  I bet that they probably would be unable to handle the added bandwidth that could add.  It would improve the resolution of MADIS by a HUGE amount, but perhaps the cost would be too high for the current CWOP infrastructure?   :-k
« Last Edit: December 24, 2009, 01:42:56 AM by WeatherGoose »


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