Measuring your electrical use

[mackbig]

Yup.

I used my kitchen lights as a test. Had it on aux4, put an extra ct on Aux 5 with a 20 ohms resistor to test.  Both read 700 watts.
So 20 ohms on aux 5 works perfectly

Did the same test on ch2, ecm 2 - ch1 , and ecm2-ch2
If you use the IA software and change those 3 channels to CT type 170, and CT range 7 it will work good with a 20 ohms resistor.  Probably a +-25 watts depending on the load on those. The lower wattage the less variation.  The only reason I know it was not perfect is because the total from Ch1 for the house, less all the other channels ended up being negative, so I put some tweaks in my php to prevent negatives.

Andrew

Have you played with their CT Resistor utility at all? I know you were working on that portion of the ECMs but was wondering if the utility itself gave you good accuracy.

[Cienega32]

I just hooked up my two "missing CT groups" to the AUX-5 spots using the 20-ohm like the book said so good to know it reads accurate. I just got hit with a t-storm so I put it all to rest.

I was playing with that utility for using the open CH spot on the 2nd ECM and it looked pretty complete. Right now, I have each main CT on each ECM Ch 1 and the pool on ECM1-Ch2. I like the little helper screen in the IA screen for the type/range setup. Very handy having it right there. They get a thumbs up from me on that alone!

The one branch that I just put on the AUX5 was for the garage outlets. I have a little boom-box in there that, along with an empty B&D batt charger, was pulling 15W waiting for me to turn it on! Another 15W from running the Brultech setup so that's a wash during idle garage times.

I see what you mean re: Brultech vs Boltek - this IS fun! And I haven't even started thinking about extracting data yet!

Thanks to SLOweather for "discovering" this toy!   Very cool indeed!!! And, Andrew - good to have you hanging around ready for the questions!


I can't wait for Tenholder's Duo-charts version. That'll be pretty neat.

[Cienega32]

Got around to playing with the software and got them all running happily now. The Tenholder server and charts, the Brultech engine and graphs and the Cassini server dashboard.

Got the TenCharts and The dashboard up on the laptop now as well. 

STILL can't get that d@#n FFox toolbar thing running. Guess I'll drop the author a line or just drop it from FFox. I really liked the toolbar for my TED that he wrote so I wouldn't mind having the Brultech version running.

[Cienega32]

Shot a line to the ToolBar author - JayNick - and the "ECM Server" software he runs is from "Bob's Place". Once I shut down the Brultech and TenHolder software, installed this other Server software, it connected. I have a newer version than he does so I think a few fields may have changed as well - I get a few of what looks to be WATT-seconds readings here and there.

He's looking into the ToolBar usage and mentioned he too is writing his own interface for the ECMs. I detailed my setup and both software setups I run so who knows what'll happen.

I find myself using the Brultech Monitor Dashboard more than the TenHolder Charts remotely but still have both running on the "server" anyway. I like the versatility of the Brultech S/W.




I just noticed a little Ohm's Law defiance in my totals across my main legs so I have to look into that little trick...

[Cienega32]

OK -I'm done.

Unless Ohm's Law is different in Canada,  this thing is goofy. 

Does anyone else have a discrepancy at their mains?

Andrew, I'm most interested in your numbers for your mains being you too have Split 200s on 100A service. But I find it hard to believe that the discrepancy would be this great. My TED is rated for 0-200A and reports fairly accurately compared to billing so - this is suspect.



This error held true for any and all hardware configs right down to that capture when I ran 1 ECM and the main Splits tied to one channel. Naturally, the internals were adjusted for every change.

The reported Watts can differ from TED up to 500-600 lower at times. Other time it's right on but the math is still bad.

[mackbig]

Pat,
Just got back from a trip to Phoenix (dont care what anyone says about "but its a dry heat", 110 is just plain hot).  Very nice though.......

My main measurements are bang on with utility.  Not sure what you are referring to in your ohm's law defiance note.

I will check out the brultech software, I did not know you could run the Engine and tenware ECM server at the same time.   Brultech had not real software options when I first got mine.

Andrew

[Cienega32]

Hope you enjoyed PHX. That dry heat is like standing in front of a hair dryer. Downtown by the ball park is a nice looking area and I enjoy staying there for a Mets game now and then.

My Ohm's Law defiance:
W/I=E
3229W/32.9A = 98.1V (the 123.6V in the screen-cap is correct and the Watts in that were close to accurate at that time)

Now that's goofy. Seems the Amps are about 5-6A too high. The Watts being "fairly close" to what they really were and the V coming from the Brultech power supply, shows a ratio of 100 to 1 (which is what caught my eye) but should be more like 100 to 0.8. That's a 20% error!

But as I mentioned, the Watts can drift from close to what TED reports to 500-600W lower. The Amps always follow the drift and always results in my Voltage calculated (W/I=E) as between 96 - 105.

 I broke everything down last nite and started from square 1 with using only the main splits on 1 channel. Both units reported the same, each main reported the same, etc etc.

I sent Ben an email late last nite about it but was wondering what the math for your main power looks like with your unit.


In the Brultech Engine (I have v2.23), under Forward Data, Home Automation, Custom, you can set up the client window for your machine IP, use port 8084 and change the port in the TenHolder server to 8084 and they'll work together (starting Brultech first).

[mackbig]

Pat,
Never noticed the amp/watt diff.... I have only ever really been concerned about watts and they seemed accurate and matched utility, but I see the math now.  I have same results as you.   Let me know what you hear back.

Thanks for the tip on using the Brultech engine, was thinking something along the lines of VVP would be cool to utilize several types of software, now it seems that it possible.

Phoenix was pretty cool (not temperature wise).  Actually we were more in Scottsdale.  Crazy how big that city is, considering how small it is population wise.  Everything was a 20-30 minute drive.  The heat was great, basically we were going for a resort trip without the fear of hurricanes in the Caribbean, and we got what we were looking for.  Great hotel, awesome weather, nice scenery, and as usual on my US trips hit the shooting range (a very good gun club).  SGC was like a very nice health club crossed with a jewelery store type gun selection (highly recommended if you like that sort of thing)

Andrew

[Cienega32]

After stretching the sample rate a bit (per Paul's suggestion) and letting it run for a while with some spot checks on running consumption numbers, the Brultech matches well with my TED. Before, it would have a fairly large difference in the "current usage".

Both devices are pretty spot on with the meter but, I have to say, the Brultech is only decimal differences. Very accurate compared to the meter.

As far as the math thing - Paul pointed out my problem by including the AC power formula in an email. I seem to suffer with a "DC is not AC" mental block. AC is different in such a case as this and I like to overlook that, it seems.

The consumption is right on the money as far as kWHs go. The ECM power supplies do report a 2V difference from I actually measure on the line - no biggie. The Amps is another number that I want to monitor on a few branches so I have to remember that AC thing   when I look at it all.

As of now, I have it all back to being wired up, made a few assignment changes and I finished tidying it up.

Scottsdale always amazes me with how good it smells. Every time I've been thru there, it smells like a garden. Glad you had a good trip!

[Cienega32]

For all you other Brultech owners:

I started developing problems here & there with my setup. I would need to power reset in order to re-establish the data xfer. Paying more attention, I learned it was the Etherport (EP-1) that was hanging. The last time it didn't come back up at all and could not be discovered by the EtherX config software.

According to Ben @Brultech, a batch of power supplies for the EP-1 had a bad cap in them that act up. At his suggestion, I tried another power source and it worked perfectly.

My symptoms were the green was steady and the yellow flashed very rapidly and steady.

Thought I would post this in case others have hiccups with theirs and don't visit the Brultech forums.


On a personal note - this, of course, happened on mine the day after I left town for a few weeks... 

[mackbig]

That's too bad Pat.  (knocking on wood as I type) my two havent missed a beat, of course they are going through a single Etherport, so I guess that was the single point of failure.

Andrew

[Cienega32]

July - August are the months I was really looking forward to graphing out too. 

The real kicker is how it waits for to leave town first before it goes. Better than the water heater tho', right? 

[mackbig]

Water heater... someone at work literally just had hers start spewing this morning.  That's something they dont make like they used to, my "old" house had one go after 4 years, her house was only 5 years old.

Washing machine hookup's are always good to go a worst time, but is there really a good time.  I just changed mine to braided ones after detecting a slow leak last week.  Better than a burst, but still would have done in the ceiling a bit if our basement had been finished.

I just got my power bill.  Cant compare costs really because I am on TOU now, but my daily KWH's for the time time frame was down 10 KWH's per day.  Not sure if it was the new a/c (june 15 2010 acquisition) or my modified pool running time I did till it got really hot in July.  Anyway its postive even if the costs probably went up.

Andrew

July - August are the months I was really looking forward to graphing out too. 

The real kicker is how it waits for to leave town first before it goes. Better than the water heater tho', right? 

[Cienega32]

Received new P/S on Monday (1 week from Canada) and all is well. Good call on Ben's part! 

[Sigdigit]

Ben posted new product info for "Greeneye".  I also just started a new thread on it.

[Cienega32]

Received new P/S on Monday (1 week from Canada) and all is well. Good call on Ben's part! 

And this week, I await yet another replacement power supply. 

[mackbig]

Doh.
both mine are chugging along.  But I knocked on wood, just in case.

Andrew

Received new P/S on Monday (1 week from Canada) and all is well. Good call on Ben's part! 

And this week, I await yet another replacement power supply. 

[Cienega32]

I fooled it this time. I was planning a Tampa trip but put it off. I guess it thought I was out of town again and figured to do it again while I was gone. 

Tammy Tech said they have a new supplier now so it should be different. I guess I'll have to wait a year to find out if it's true. This last replacement was identical to the original in its labeling so I may have just received a "replacement" unit and not a replacement unit, if you get that. Should be here any day now but the thing that gets me is I'm STILL waiting to see my full numbers for the summer without data dropouts.  

I'll say this about that crew (Ben, Tammy, etc) - they sure aim to please. Now if they would only get that new unit out the door. I did my panel upgrade (100A to 200A) last November and have wanting to expand my Brultech a bit until I saw that new unit they have in the works.

[Sigdigit]

Taking them forever to get that Greeneye out to the masses.  And it's definitely not 'turnkey'.  Seems you have to be a computer/software jockey to tweak it and make various software play well with it.  I don't have the time/inclination to do that.

Installing the CT's seems pretty easy, but after reading comments on Brultech's forum, WOW!  Why can't they have software that comes with the unit that you simply download, then have some sort of set-up walk through?  Similar to Weatherlink?

[Old Tele man]

Anybody using something to monitor/measure the 220VAC power line to their airconditioning unit? The "Kill-A-Watt®EZ" device seems to only come with 110VAC plug-in connector(s).

[mackbig]

I have my Brultech connected to my A/C, oven, and pool pump.  They are all 220 volt.

Andrew

Anybody using something to monitor/measure the 220VAC power line to their airconditioning unit? The "Kill-A-Watt®EZ" device seems to only come with 110VAC plug-in connector(s).

[Old Tele man]

I have my Brultech connected to my A/C, oven, and pool pump.  They are all 220 volt.

Andrew

Anybody using something to monitor/measure the 220VAC power line to their airconditioning unit? The "Kill-A-Watt®EZ" device seems to only come with 110VAC plug-in connector(s).

Did you do your own installation of the "current transformer" (CT) sensors, or did you have a certified electrician do the installations? How's the operational reliability of that Brultech, better or worse than your wireless weather station?

[mackbig]

I did my own installation.   30-60 seconds per CT. 

-turn breaker off
-loosen screw
-pull out wire
-slide CT on
-push wire back in
-tighten screw
-turn breaker on

I have had zero downtime since install. 100% reliability as far as I know.   So better than weather station....

Knocking on wood, as I know Pat has had power supply issues.

Andrew

[Old Tele man]

"Thanks!" for the information, I'm thinking about getting something to monitor & measure our 220V BIG-current "hogs" (AC, stove/oven, laundry dryer). Except for the AC, all have normal three-prong 220VAC plugs which can be accessed...but, not the AC, it's hard-wired thru a "fuse" plug. 

[Cienega32]

I have a WattsUp Pro device with the same limitations as the KillAWatt device. That was a big factor in me going with the Brultech setup - the ability to monitor the hard-wired loads. The other, of course, was being able to monitor and track day to day usage on the "normal" branch circuits.

My heat/cool circuit is 120V and the swamp cooler is hard-wired. The other was for the 240V pool sub-panel. It paid off with both as I noticed a problem with my swamp cooler early and also caught my pool pump on the decline. The consumption went up noticeably over time on both and was easy to spot with the Brultech. I can throw in a June refrigerator problem in the mix of "noticed before failure" too.

My only issue, as Andrew said, has been in the power supply but only the one for the Ethernet device. The Brultech system itself kept going - I just couldn't get the data over my network to the monitoring software. Brultech sent me replacement as soon as it was mentioned to them so 5 stars for their support. They had a bad batch and this last replacement is a different style and I have no doubt that I'll have zero problems next year with this one. 

My pool sub wiring has the 60A current transformers on it which are splits that just snap over the cable as do the main conductor CTs. The others are as Andrew detailed - easy. Myself, I power down the entire panel - branch breakers and the main just so I can breeze thru it without any worry and for a little more speed of task.

Definitely one of my better household investments.