Author Topic: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution  (Read 3986 times)

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Offline jeff986

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Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« on: February 27, 2014, 11:51:57 PM »
All - My goal is to collect real time water temperature information from my lake, and to make that data available on my web server [along with all the other real-time weather data I collect.]   I have been scouring the web for the right hardware for several days and can't seem to find the right combination.  Here are my solution requirements and information about my current setup and abilities:

  • I have a wireless Davis Vantage Pro 2 ISS placed about 100 feet from the house.  It successfully (wirelessly) sends basic weather information (temp, humidity, baro, rain, wind speed/dir) to its console, which I extract via USB/serial to a Linux host.  I have power and (wired) Ethernet near the ISS, but it is not used by the ISS. I have written lots of software for the Linux host, and can write whatever is needed if I can actually get this new data to the machine.
  • The lake I want to monitor is about 250 feet away from the VP2 ISS (350 feet away from the Linux machine).   It is not logistically practical to move the ISS to the lake and to use the wired temp sensor for the VP2.  [I also believe the ISS would be out of range of its console if I did so.]  I expect this means I will need to buy a new, separate system, which is fine (and probably even desirable).
  • It's also not practical for me to run any sort of wire from the lake to the vicinity of the ISS (or to the Linux machine).  As such, I have been looking for a wireless solution that would collect the lake temperature, and transmit it to some sort of "head end" device which could be located either near the ISS or by the VP2 console.  The head-end device preferably needs to be reachable from Linux either via WiFi or wired Ethernet, but I suppose I could tolerate an USB/Serial connection.
  • I REQUIRE direct LOCAL access to extract data from this head-end device (i.e. I do not want it to be like the "Lacrosse Alerts" service, where the head-end device sends data ONLY to the manufacturer's cloud and fee-based service).  Ideally the head-end would have its own HTTP server or similar.  I just don't want to pay a recurring fee to go get this data off the cloud..
  • I have been looking at head-end devices like the WebIO v3 (http://www.webio.us/version3/index.html), which is EXACTLY the right solution for me except for one small thing:  I can't identify a wireless water temperature sensor with which it is compatible and that has sufficient range. Oregon Scientific used to make a compatible wireless temperature sensor with probe (the THC268), but it is no longer in production and I can't find any for sale.  The Oregon Scientific THWR800 presumably has sufficient range, but unfortunately uses v3 of Oregon's comm protocol which is not supported by the WebIO (which supports only v2.1.  There is no ability to write new v3 drivers for the WebIO).
  • I have explored purchasing a THWR800 with a compatible Oregon Scientific weather station head-end.  They only offer solutions that are USB/Serial to a computer which is doable (although not desirable), but my belief is that the distance from the lake to the Oregon head-end (and thus the Linux box) exceeds the range of the THWR800 (which is advertised at 300 feet, which I expect to be optimistic).  I do not find a "repeater" from Oregon Scientific that I could place mid-way.
  • I have also been looking at devices from Monnit, which seemingly have have the range (900 feet), but unfortunately, their head-end gateway only will communicate with their fee-based monitoring service. (It also only has polling granularity of 5 minutes).  Devices from enviromon.net, albeit very expensive, would be perfect if they had a wireless sensor

I am frustrated that every solution I find seems to be missing one key functionality i require.   

If anyone has hardware suggestions, please throw them at me. Ideally this would cost no more than $500.  I apologize if the requirements/parameters I've provided above are confusing or scattered.  Please ask questions to help clarify as needed.   I am a software geek and can cobble together a software solution.. 

Thanks for all your help!    [/list]

Offline SLOweather

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2014, 12:14:13 AM »
OK. You already have a wireless VP2. I saw no mention in your post of the Davis 6372 Wireless Temperature Station.

That has a cabled probe suitable for immersion in water (I run one in our spa, and one in our greenhouse).

It can be received and displayed on the VP2 console.

The Davis units are speced for ~1000 ft in open terrain. I have used them up to 1700' open, through trees and walls, and over 2000 feet LOS. Unless you have a mountain between the lake and the console, it should work. If it doesn't, Davis offers data repeaters, as well.

Offline George Richardson

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2014, 08:23:16 AM »
Hey Jeff,

I think I have in place exactly what you are asking for. Check http://www.smlweather.com/ and ask any questions. I had a guy look me up last year and ask for lake temperatures for the previous year and I was able to give them to him. (Not from the web site but from my WeatherLink records.

HTH

George

Offline Bushman

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2014, 09:59:06 AM »
As stated, either of the standalone temp stations frm Davis will work with the stainless probe.  I use one of the solar ones and one of the battery one, each with a probe.  One in the lake and the other in the spa.  Done.

Offline piconut

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2014, 11:43:13 AM »
ditto here.  I use two of the temperature probes to monitor pond temperatures so I know when to stop feeding the fish (they can't process proteins when the water temperature goes below 50 degrees F).
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Offline CNYWeather

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2014, 12:15:29 PM »
ditto here.  I use two of the temperature probes to monitor pond temperatures so I know when to stop feeding the fish (they can't process proteins when the water temperature goes below 50 degrees F).

Sorry, OT but mine like to be fed all winter up here. They congregate around the heater & love it when I feed them.
Tony




Offline Skywatch

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2014, 01:54:44 PM »
I think it depends on the temperature below the thermocline. The natural thermal barrier that exist below the water's surface. The surface maybe cold but the pond bottom may be warm enough that the fish can be active. Jeff, You say you have a budget of 500$ right? Maybe you can buy 2 temperature stations and monitor temps at different depths. I've been involved in lake management a little over the years and this is something I've learned.
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Offline tosealer

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2014, 05:26:55 PM »
How about setting up a Raspberry Pi with a wired temperature sensor?  The Pi can wirelessly connect to your network.  And if you're a linux guy, should be routine to whip up some software (or use what's available online).

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Offline gt651

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2014, 03:53:24 PM »
"I am frustrated that every solution I find seems to be missing one key functionality i require. "

Me too - I've searched for the same thing and always come up frustrated.

One solution I've found lately that looks good but a little spendy is from PointSix. 

http://www.pointsix.com/900mhz.html (I tried to attach the data sheets but they are too big)
3009-20-V4
4009-43

The sensor costs $202.80 and the receiver is $368.25 and I'm not sure about the sensor.

I've used a homemade wireless system to do this for 5 years but I wouldn't recommend it. 

http://www.mnlakecams.com/historic_water_temperatures.php


What's needed is a system that will periodically push the the current temperature to your server via HTTP Post.  I've used this http://www.controlbyweb.com/temperature/ but I have to pull the data via a cron job.  I use Ubiquity NanoStations for the wireless.

Offline Dr Obbins

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2014, 04:41:29 PM »
OK. You already have a wireless VP2. I saw no mention in your post of the Davis 6372 Wireless Temperature Station.

That has a cabled probe suitable for immersion in water (I run one in our spa, and one in our greenhouse).

It can be received and displayed on the VP2 console.

The Davis units are speced for ~1000 ft in open terrain. I have used them up to 1700' open, through trees and walls, and over 2000 feet LOS. Unless you have a mountain between the lake and the console, it should work. If it doesn't, Davis offers data repeaters, as well.
I use one for the swimming pool, then the data is displayed on my website. The battery hasn't been replaced due to the winter weather, but there is a example at the bottom of the page (blue line).

Offline wthrmn654

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2014, 08:36:30 AM »
What would you do when dealing with salt water, say a state park wanting to keep public updated daily on water temperatures? Any thoughts idea? Doesn't have to be Davis, etc.if you know a site it information that might help me would be awesome!

Offline Bushman

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2014, 10:33:56 AM »
Just use a stainless or other non-reactive probe.

Offline wthrmn654

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2014, 10:45:59 AM »
Wireless system?

Offline Bushman

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2014, 12:50:49 PM »
Here you go:  80 bucks with the Internet link.  http://wirelesstags.myshopify.com/products/long-range-water-moisture-sensor

Offline gt651

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2014, 10:55:25 AM »
Next thing I'm going to try for lake temperature is this:

http://www.monnit.com/Products/Wireless-Sensors/Industrial/900-MHz/Wireless-Water-Temperature-Sensors

They can make the sensor cable longer on request.

Plus a receiver like this or a cellular one:

http://www.monnit.com/Products/Gateways/Ethernet-Gateway/900-MHz/Wireless-Gateways

This will push data to your server but they charge $40/year for this option.

Offline Bushman

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2014, 11:03:08 AM »
$400 bucks?  Ouch.  Plus annual PUSH fees?  Why not just get a Davis station (headless IP etc.)

Offline gt651

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2014, 12:19:59 PM »
I'm not familiar with weather stations, can you point me to the parts I would need - thanks.

Offline bliebb

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2018, 09:26:03 AM »
The company Symcod offer a  long range 900 mhz IP65 temperature sensor at a good price… The distance is around 2 km without obstacle.  No software or subscription is required the data can be sent via Modbus, RS232, USB, TCPIP ASCII text or Cellular.  The name of this solution is NEURON-AIR all information on website manufacturer SYMCOD.COM ;)


hoping to have helped you!

Offline Bushman

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2018, 10:17:10 AM »
Only price I can find for that Symcod STARTER (one slave and master) is over a $1000 CAD!  Ouch!  Love these OPW ads...  ;)

Offline bliebb

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2018, 01:21:41 PM »
I can’t remember the exact price I paid for my Symcod Neuron-Air … But it was way under 500$ CAD (retail price) for a master and a slave :!:

Offline Brientim

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Re: Needed: Wireless Water Temperature Solution
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2018, 01:37:15 PM »
One thing that may fit in to your design requirements and provide options is the. Rfxtrx from rfxcom.com. 

This is widely used in various applications; especially home automation, to integrate sensors, it come in 3 frequency and one being 433 MHz which support Oregon V3 protocols and devices.

The other one I think offer a solution is called Papago from Papouch.com