Vantage Vue Console Key Durability

[miraculon]

I just got a Vantage Vue console for a 2nd display for my VP2. I wall mounted it in the basement and it is working well. I actually like the smaller size for the location that I tucked it into.

I was wondering about the keys. Some electronic devices with the membrane switches seem to crack and fail after a while. The VUE keys seem thick and robust. Do they last OK? Has anyone had any issues with them? No problems, but I am wondering if they are better than the usual membrane-type switch...
 

[DaculaWeather]

Never use mine so I don't know!

[C5250]

I was wondering about the keys. Some electronic devices with the membrane switches seem to crack and fail after a while. The VUE keys seem thick and robust. Do they last OK? Has anyone had any issues with them? No problems, but I am wondering if they are better than the usual membrane-type switch...
 

Not that it means much... But I added a Vue Console soon after they became available (in Oct of 2009) and haven't seen any issue with the keys. I don't think I've ever seen a tactical membrane type keypad fail, what have you seen this happen on?

[hayskswx]

Never use mine so I don't know!

I dusted mine off the other day. Dint use mine either. I just leave mine on the wind.

[Johnny25]

I use the keys quite often. Seem durable to me. No problems so far. I guess like most things, they'll eventually wear out at some point!

[4wd]

I switch the light on most days (but turn off overnight) - so that will be the one to wear out eventually.

[miraculon]

what have you seen this happen on?

Our coffee maker at work seems to be notorious for this. We are on the 2nd machine (for other reasons than the keys) and the applique over the switches are cracked to the point of seeing the underlying switch.

I have seen this somewhere else, but my memory fails me (getting to be kind of normal these days...)

Greg

[C5250]

Our coffee maker at work seems to be notorious for this. We are on the 2nd machine (for other reasons than the keys) and the applique over the switches are cracked to the point of seeing the underlying switch.

I have seen this somewhere else, but my memory fails me (getting to be kind of normal these days...)

Greg

Best guess, some "Made in China" junk. As much as I hate to label everything made in China with that label, most seems to be of no better quality than a novelty item.

[belfryboy]

That's not really a fair comment though, I supply the UK and USA aerospace markets and regularly use China as a supply base. I am very impressed with a lot of things that come "off the shelf" . Although you do get some crap coming out as well. I suspect that if peeled back the layers of the onion you'd find the Davis "proudly made in the USA" tagline really means made in China, assembled and packaged in the USA. As a responsible supplier I expect Davis keep an eye on their suppliers.

[johnd]

Although you do get some crap coming out as well. I suspect that if peeled back the layers of the onion you'd find the Davis "proudly made in the USA" tagline really means made in China, assembled and packaged in the USA.

That's pretty much what Davis say these days. And aren't most Apple products made in China now, along with a considerable proportion of other PC kit that we use? So hardly a byword for poor quality, though I'm sure it depends on the price point at which you looking to source supply.

What I find both interesting and curious at present in the weather stations context is that China seems content to supply only the cheap end of the market - ie Watson/Lacrosse etc. The Chinese certainly have the wherewithall to compete head-on with Davis in terms of features and quality. Why are they holding back?

[nickdeck]

"And aren't most Apple products made in China now..."

Yes, at least the iPad is. I bought one recently, and the UPS tracking report began in China.

I think Chinese products pretty much run the gamut these days. If a manufacturer is willing the pay for quality, the Chinese are capable of supplying it. There's definitely a market for likes of LaCrosse, etc., and they can provide for that too.

[Bushman]

Davis no longer uses Made in USA since they are not made in the US.

[George Richardson]

If you own land in the USA, and that land has trees on it, which you cut down and have sawn, at the local saw mill, into boards. And you then use those boards to raise a house. That house is probably NOT "Made in the USA" because the nails used to assemble your house were not made in the US from ore that was mined in the US and then made into metal that was then made into nails!

Due to LEGAL requirements for use of the term "Made in the USA", and the fact that some commonly used electronic components are simply not manufactured in the US, I seriously doubt any electronic module and therefore any finished product that has electronics can use the term "Made in the USA", ie, automobiles.

Davis weather stations are " manufactured in Hayward, California".

JMO

George

"Davis no longer uses Made in USA since they are not made in the US."

"Davis no longer uses Made in USA"  True

"since they are not made in the US." Not true.

[johnd]

I think Chinese products pretty much run the gamut these days. If a manufacturer is willing the pay for quality, the Chinese are capable of supplying it. There's definitely a market for likes of LaCrosse, etc., and they can provide for that too.

Yes, but the point I was trying to make was that as far as I can see the Chinese are _originating_ the design of eg the Watson type stations, including all the various branded clones (and I think at least some of the LaCrosse models). Certainly the Chinese factory is offering these models to allcomers within the trade.

But the same does not seem to happening (as yet) for higher specification stations - which I find a bit surprising. That the Chinese can manufacture high spec boards is not in question but they are also perfectly capable of designing higher spec stations at low cost, it's just for some reason they're not choosing to do so for now.

[graculus]

Don't forget Oregon Scientific, that's a Chinese company too.

Consider the size of the higher end market, is it really worth it compared to the volume of lower end stuff sold through retail worldwide? 

[dalecoy]

But the same does not seem to happening (as yet) for higher specification stations - which I find a bit surprising. That the Chinese can manufacture high spec boards is not in question but they are also perfectly capable of designing higher spec stations at low cost, it's just for some reason they're not choosing to do so for now.

Relatively low volume is probably the biggest factor.
Coupled with a relatively-high price point (that combination limits distribution channels).   
Moderate difficulty in getting sophisticated RF equipment tested and certified/accepted in the US and other countries.  (e.g., FHSS or whatever)
Market already saturated with a wide variety of products, at prices from casual to high, with hard-to-discriminate features and specifications.
Oh, and then there's software, data archiving (logger), and "easy" web presence infrastructure (like WeatherLink.com).

[johnd]

...Several erudite comments

Yes, I think this largely boils down to marketing and support.

China has traditionally specialised in high volume / (relatively) low margin production so yes I agree that it's potentially a mental step-change to think about lower volume but higher margin goods, but which in the end will yield as much if not more profit. I'm sure they're well aware of this but for whatever reason are not making the transition currently, at least in the weather stations' sector.

Not sure I'm convinced about the difficulties of certification nowadays. If we're talking wireless aren't these essentially based on commodity chips nowadays which, provided they're implemented according to manufacturer's recommendations, should fairly automatically pass certification. (Not saying that they can avoid a formal process of certification, but I wouldn't have imagined it to be be too much of a barrier.)

I absolutely don't think that the market for midrange (eg Davis standard) AWS systems is saturated. It really should be pretty straightforward from where I'm sitting for a Davis spec AWS to be introduced for eg 50-70% of the Davis price or superior spec for an equivalent price, especially outside the US where the Davis distribution model forces up local prices.

But yes, support and marketing are an area where a local partner organisation would probably be beneficial. But there's no shortage of ideas and willing partners - just give me a call.

Edit: Sorry, had meant also to include a comment about software: TBH I don't see this as much of an issue. I would have thought that either Steve (Cumulus) or Brian (WD) (or one othe other established wx programs) would, for a reasonable consideration, be happy to include a new station type to their repertoire. And, at the same time, I'm not sure that the use of wx software isn't already changing fundamentally, towards much more of a web platform. So, all types of station, including Davis, will be looking to move to a new software strategy.

[C5250]

I suspect that if peeled back the layers of the onion you'd find the Davis "proudly made in the USA" tagline really means made in China, assembled and packaged in the USA. As a responsible supplier I expect Davis keep an eye on their suppliers.

What you will find is "made in Taiwan", technically also China, but not the same. 

Note that I did not claim everything from China was junk, they are capable of producing a quality product, but the interest in doing so seems to be limited. That may well be, in part, driven by product buyers trying to obtain products for the least possible cost. Things may be different in your part of the world, in this part of the world most products from China are way over priced for what little value that they provide.

[graculus]

FTC's page about made in usa compliance. I'm a happy Davis user but since (AFAIK) all the electronics are assembled in China, and most of the electronic components will not have been made in the USA, I don't see how Davis can justify their "made in the United States" claim.