Topic: OS THGR810, I'm puzzled

[stevebrtx]

I have an 800 and the humidity section has failed, so went to order a new one - thanks, OS, they're discontinued. So, looked at the THGR810 and they state the following:

"For use with the WMR90A, WMR100, WMR100N and WMR200. Choose channels 4 through 10 (Channel 1 is reserved for the outdoor sensor and Channels 2-3 are reserved for the THGR800).

This is the replacement for the Oregon Scientific THGR800 that has been discontinued."

I'm a bit puzzled by this because my 800 WAS my channel #1 and I have a second one that is channel #2. If I read this correctly, the 810 won't work on channels 1-3 and I have to move those reading to a new channel and then try to deal with tags?

I swore last year I'd never spend another cent with OS, guess I should heed my own advice.

[Downlinerz2]

    While I always like my WMR 968 I have to say that OS as an entity often left me "puzzled" to say the least!   And it is stuff like that which caused me the most headaches.  Nothing was very well planned as far as say the manuals and such.  Hasn't improved much I see.  That's the one thing that makes me nervous about putting my 968 back in service.
 

[Skywatch]

I have an 800 and the humidity section has failed, so went to order a new one - thanks, OS, they're discontinued. So, looked at the THGR810 and they state the following:

"For use with the WMR90A, WMR100, WMR100N and WMR200. Choose channels 4 through 10 (Channel 1 is reserved for the outdoor sensor and Channels 2-3 are reserved for the THGR800).

This is the replacement for the Oregon Scientific THGR800 that has been discontinued."

I'm a bit puzzled by this because my 800 WAS my channel #1 and I have a second one that is channel #2. If I read this correctly, the 810 won't work on channels 1-3 and I have to move those reading to a new channel and then try to deal with tags?

I swore last year I'd never spend another cent with OS, guess I should heed my own advice.

The THGR810 will work with channels 1, 2, 3, and so forth. I have 2 of those THGR810's. They work fine with channels 2 and 3. I don't know where it says it won't work. It does for me. OS probably discontinued the 3 channel (800) becasue there's no sence making a 3 channel sensor when they have a 10 channel sensor. It would be too expensive to manufacture 2 sensors. At least that's my theory.

[gadget_guy]

I think the intent was more of a warning not to put the sensor on the reserved channel if one already existed there.  Sigh.  Good clear instructions are rare.

[stevebrtx]

Thanks guys, so it will work, now I'm down to pouring good money down the OS rat hole, or chucking it into a "pesos for Davis" saving account.

[DanS]

If you feel up to it you could open up the faulty sensor to see if it has one of these in it Since you mention only the humidity went bad I would lean toward you having one in there. If so there's a very easy trick to try that may be the answer. It probably has a vented plastic case snapped on around it so you have to look close.

[Downlinerz2]

If you feel up to it you could open up the faulty sensor to see if it has one of these in it Since you mention only the humidity went bad I would lean toward you having one in there. If so there's a very easy trick to try that may be the answer. It probably has a vented plastic case snapped on around it so you have to look close.

   What is that Dan?  Trying to learn in case I ever have to look for such a thing.
    Mark

[DanS]

It's basically just 2 circuit traces woven together close to each other but not touching. An open circuit. A hygroscopic compound is applied across these circuit traces that changes it's conductive value from the amount of moisture in the surrounding air. A varying resistance humidity sensor.

Dan

[Downlinerz2]

It's basically just 2 circuit traces woven together close to each other but not touching. An open circuit. A hygroscopic compound is applied across these circuit traces that changes it's conductive value from the amount of moisture in the surrounding air. A varying resistance humidity sensor.
Dan

   Thanks for the quick reply Dan.  Appreciate it.
 Mg

[FrozenPenguin]

I also had to read that statement a few times in the manual, but it is indeed a warning only that those channels may be taken by "default" sensors.  810 can be set to any (1 thru 10).   I find technical manuals in general often are horrible....no wonder the average non-techie out there is utterly confused by anything sold this day in age.   

Speaking of poor manuals, if you didn't read my post about the OS solar panels, do check the thread.

Thanks guys, so it will work, now I'm down to pouring good money down the OS rat hole, or chucking it into a "pesos for Davis" saving account.

Davis isn't bulletproof either.   Have a friend with Davis, and he complains about his rain bucket not emptying, etc.  All hardware can fail.    Keep in mind this stuff is outside exposed to weather 24-7.     So far I've had no issues with my OS stuff, works great.   

[stevebrtx]

Dan,

Ha, of course I opened it and I tend to think I'm fairly technical, so first I thought a spider might have taken up residence, and indeed there was a very tiny one living in there, but not the problem. So, not knowing about hygroscopic coatings, I decided I'd just "clean" it a bit with alcohol - biggie mistake, it apparently dissolves hygroscopic material and the sensor promptly went to 10% and that was the end of the story, so lesson learned, but no great loss.

I'm in a bit of a quandary regarding the weather station, it does have a "following" and so I feel a responsibility to the community and of course gratitude. I rent this place and I'll be leaving in a year, so there is no telling where the new casa will be or what its configuration will be. So, investing in more OS gear is one option, or limping a bit until next year and then deciding on a Davis wired, or wireless or? - will be the challenge.

I'd love to have the resources (see $$$) to buy three or four professional stations and place them at different points along the N shore and S as well. As we all know, "weather" can often be very localized and so when I get rain here someone 15 miles away carps about none. And temps vary considerably due to lake/mountains/thermal mass etc. and so it would be fun to have several, but it is what it is and Max the WeatherCat and I do the best we can with what we have.

[SlowModem]

Ha, of course I opened it and I tend to think I'm fairly technical, so first I thought a spider might have taken up residence, and indeed there was a very tiny one living in there, but not the problem. So, not knowing about hygroscopic coatings, I decided I'd just "clean" it a bit with alcohol - biggie mistake, it apparently dissolves hygroscopic material and the sensor promptly went to 10% and that was the end of the story, so lesson learned, but no great loss.

Yeah, I did that once with a 968.     You can try to find a hair gel (dipity do) with polyethylene glycol and put on the sensor.  I got mine to work a little bit that way, but ended up getting a solid state sensor before I got it completely calibrated.

Good luck! 

[DanS]

Yes, as Greg mentioned, Hair gel with Polyethylene Glycol (PEG-#) ingredient may work in restoring that component. I found if the original compound gets corrupted (touched, wiped, etc.) you can clean the component real good, like you say with alcohol, while watching the display to verify when you hit the lowest the sensor is spec'd to read. It may take several cleanings to do this. Once your are there, use a cotton swab and apply a thin smear of the gel making sure to cover the entire grid area. Wait and watch the humidity display jump up and later start dropping as the gel sets up. When the display settles you can add another layer to thicken the application if needed to result in slightly higher sensitivity, or readings range.
I've experimented with different brands of gel containing PEG with various amounts and found one labeled "Extra-Body" with PEG-12 works great.
Hope it works for you.

Dan

added: When I shipped my old ws-2310 over here in 2006 the trip over corrupted my sensor (salt air for a week as it went by sea?). So, I did this gel fix to it and here's a graph of it (D4009) against the Met. Department's (VTCC) across the street.

[stevebrtx]

Thanks, what an interesting fix. Here in MX, they certainly do have hair gel, the kids are big on spiked hair, I'll just have to try to figure out which one has the magic and give it a try.

[DanS]

It's the moisture absorption and rate of evaporation properties of the gel that make the difference. I've found L'Oreal "Wetlook" and Paul Mitchell "Extra-Body" in the plastic squeeze bottle have worked with great results. I'm not sure if it's the PEG amounts in them along with the other ingredients or what but do know they work well. Good luck!

Dan

[stevebrtx]

Wow, what an adventure. I went to one of our local mercados and Oh My Gosh, it was like years ago before my wife passed away; "honey get me a tube of hair gel while you're at the store please". And, you feel your lips go numb, the fingers begin to tingle as you approach the "hair gel section" and find more different brands of hair gel in more different containers (all the way from a tube to a tub) and you're standing there like the 68 year old idiot you are trying to make out something recognizable in Spanish. Mercifully I finally came across a L'Oreal Studio InvisiFX gel and I headed for checkout. It must do something because after Dan's procedure it jumped from 10% to 93% and is now settling back down.

Oops, looks like we can cross that one off the list, we're at 38% and falling and the humidity should read 62%, so back to the hair gel section - but what the heck am I going to do with a tube of hair gel?

[SlowModem]

It must do something because after Dan's procedure it jumped from 10% to 93% and is now settling back down.

Oops, looks like we can cross that one off the list, we're at 38% and falling and the humidity should read 62%, so back to the hair gel section - but what the heck am I going to do with a tube of hair gel?

Look at the ingredients list (it may take a magnifying glass!).  Sometimes they list percentages of ingredients.  You want PEG.  The higher the percentage, the better.

You may just need to apply some more gel to the sensor.  It may take several applications before you have enough to work well.

[stevebrtx]

Ah, maybe my inpatients did me in. It says it has PEG-40 and yes, it took a big magnifying glass to find that once I got it back here at the casa. Seems we're hanging at 31% which is up from 10%, so maybe more applications will bring it back up, thanks, I'll try it, afterall I have enough hair gel to last me at my rate of usage until I'm somewhere around 200 years old - ha.

[DanS]

Wow, what an adventure. I went to one of our local mercados and Oh My Gosh, it was like years ago before my wife passed away; "honey get me a tube of hair gel while you're at the store please". And, you feel your lips go numb, the fingers begin to tingle as you approach the "hair gel section" and find more different brands of hair gel in more different containers (all the way from a tube to a tub) and you're standing there like the 68 year old idiot you are trying to make out something recognizable in Spanish. Mercifully I finally came across a L'Oreal Studio InvisiFX gel and I headed for checkout. It must do something because after Dan's procedure it jumped from 10% to 93% and is now settling back down.

Oops, looks like we can cross that one off the list, we're at 38% and falling and the humidity should read 62%, so back to the hair gel section - but what the heck am I going to do with a tube of hair gel?

Before you run out for a new tube, give that application ample time to set up. Maybe 45 minutes or so then apply another layer over top of that one and let it settle again. Always apply in thin layers and let setup before applying the next. You may have "the right stuff" already just a couple of layers (setup in between) needed to get there. If after several layers you find it won't maintain the required percentage and keeps falling too low then, as Greg points out, it's the PEG properties in that batch are not quite right. Through the many various applications I've tried I have seen what you've described, the falling readings as well as the readings staying too high all relating to the PEG numbers in the different brand gels. The applications I've found that work the best contain PEG 8 to 12 and may have derivatives such as PEG14 Dimethicone included as well.
The batch I'm using on my 2310 has been there since the beginning of Nov., 2008 so it appears to have the advertised "Long Lasting Hold" too.

[FrozenPenguin]

Wow, what an adventure. I went to one of our local mercados and Oh My Gosh, it was like years ago before my wife passed away; "honey get me a tube of hair gel while you're at the store please". And, you feel your lips go numb, the fingers begin to tingle as you approach the "hair gel section" and find more different brands of hair gel in more different containers (all the way from a tube to a tub) and you're standing there like the 68 year old idiot you are trying to make out something recognizable in Spanish. Mercifully I finally came across a L'Oreal Studio InvisiFX gel and I headed for checkout. It must do something because after Dan's procedure it jumped from 10% to 93% and is now settling back down.

Oops, looks like we can cross that one off the list, we're at 38% and falling and the humidity should read 62%, so back to the hair gel section - but what the heck am I going to do with a tube of hair gel?

Before you run out for a new tube, give that application ample time to set up. Maybe 45 minutes or so then apply another layer over top of that one and let it settle again. Always apply in thin layers and let setup before applying the next. You may have "the right stuff" already just a couple of layers (setup in between) needed to get there. If after several layers you find it won't maintain the required percentage and keeps falling too low then, as Greg points out, it's the PEG properties in that batch are not quite right. Through the many various applications I've tried I have seen what you've described, the falling readings as well as the readings staying too high all relating to the PEG numbers in the different brand gels. The applications I've found that work the best contain PEG 8 to 12 and may have derivatives such as PEG14 Dimethicone included as well.
The batch I'm using on my 2310 has been there since the beginning of Nov., 2008 so it appears to have the advertised "Long Lasting Hold" too.

Maybe your thgr810  needs some Viagra and KY! 

[stevebrtx]

The 3rd application has us pretty close, about 3% difference to the 100 console so maybe it's going to work out. I was just thinking and chuckling, one day when I die, maybe 20 years from now and someone cleans out under the sink and comes up with that tube of gel and asks "now why the heck would an 88 year old guy have a new tube of hair gel?"

[DanS]

The 3rd application has us pretty close, about 3% difference to the 100 console so maybe it's going to work out. I was just thinking and chuckling, one day when I die, maybe 20 years from now and someone cleans out under the sink and comes up with that tube of gel and asks "now why the heck would an 88 year old guy have a new tube of hair gel?"

Once you determine how many applications gets you what you need maybe you can write a little note and tape it on the gel tube. Something like "3 layers keeps it up". That will really confuse whoever finds it under the sink.

[stevebrtx]

Good one, that has lots of potential to be a case of "delayed unintended consequences".

[Old Tele man]

...as I understand OSI's WMR200A operation, the first two wireless channel allocations (Ch#0 and Ch#1) are "dedicated" and cannot be re-allocated:

Ch#0 = inside console TEMP/RH (physically within console)
CH#1 = outside remote TEMP/RH (THGN801)
Ch#2-thru-Ch#10 = user selectable (ie: THGR810, etc.)