Author Topic: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3  (Read 27193 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Cleofide

  • Orange, FR
  • Senior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 50
    • METEOrange
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #50 on: April 07, 2017, 05:52:26 PM »
Any news, I fear to ask?
Florian-Pierre Zanardi,
http://www.meteorange.fr/
Wireless VP2, double solar-paneled daytime FARS, Anemometer Transmitter Kit.

Offline dalecoy

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 6447
    • Lee's Summit, MO
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #51 on: April 07, 2017, 09:15:24 PM »

Offline Jáchym

  • Meteotemplate Developer
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 8605
    • Meteotemplate
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #52 on: April 07, 2017, 11:11:56 PM »
Lol

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #53 on: April 08, 2017, 05:19:40 AM »
What do people think that Davis might actually do next? (Not asking what people might ideally like to see to suit their own individual pet preferences, ie not more myVP3 ideas and speculations, but bearing in mind that Davis has to look for profit across the whole of their customer base, what might they actually do next?)
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Cleofide

  • Orange, FR
  • Senior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 50
    • METEOrange
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #54 on: April 08, 2017, 05:29:00 AM »
I don't think they are up for any major upgrade before long. More like small, yet useful, improvements such as a more effective rain cone, or weather vane.
What's really starting to look cheap is the console.

I wonder why they asked for people's input two years ago and then did nothing.
Florian-Pierre Zanardi,
http://www.meteorange.fr/
Wireless VP2, double solar-paneled daytime FARS, Anemometer Transmitter Kit.

Offline Mattk

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2134
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #55 on: April 08, 2017, 05:34:24 AM »
Quote
....what might they actually do next?

A Red dot logger

Offline Bashy

  • brecklandweather.com/meteo
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1465
  • brecklandweather.com/index.php
    • Breckland Weather
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #56 on: April 08, 2017, 05:41:28 AM »
A touch screen console perhaps?
Kind regards
Bashy

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #57 on: April 08, 2017, 05:59:54 AM »
A Red dot logger

Post needs an edit with an emoji? ;)
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Jáchym

  • Meteotemplate Developer
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 8605
    • Meteotemplate
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #58 on: April 08, 2017, 06:15:35 AM »
I don't think they are up for any major upgrade before long. More like small, yet useful, improvements such as a more effective rain cone, or weather vane.
What's really starting to look cheap is the console.

I wonder why they asked for people's input two years ago and then did nothing.

I think it was at least 5 years ago

Offline Cleofide

  • Orange, FR
  • Senior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 50
    • METEOrange
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #59 on: April 08, 2017, 06:28:37 AM »
All the more reason. It was in 2013. I was just asking, en passant, since I am renewing my station. Not expecting much from them.
Florian-Pierre Zanardi,
http://www.meteorange.fr/
Wireless VP2, double solar-paneled daytime FARS, Anemometer Transmitter Kit.

Offline dalecoy

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 6447
    • Lee's Summit, MO
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #60 on: April 08, 2017, 02:45:33 PM »
Any news, I fear to ask?

No.

What part of No was not a sufficient answer?  [Please do not answer that question and continue this topic]

Offline SLOweather

  • Global Moderator
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 3456
    • Weatherelement Moline IL
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #61 on: April 11, 2017, 02:03:03 PM »
What do people think that Davis might actually do next? (Not asking what people might ideally like to see to suit their own individual pet preferences, ie not more myVP3 ideas and speculations, but bearing in mind that Davis has to look for profit across the whole of their customer base, what might they actually do next?)

OK, John, I'll take a shot... :) These comments are made with observation and input from reading this forum, as well as experience.

Based on recent improvements in the outdoor sensors (anemometer/rain cone/temp-hum). I'd say the ISS and extra wireless sensors are stable, with only incremental/evolutionary (not revolutionary) changes to come. Davis has a large customer base, of which the hobbyist/homeowner is a fairly small fraction. Not only do they sell complete stations, but also supply sensors with decent app notes to other manufacturers. They are also willing to customize products for a big enough order. (Want 100 or more cabled ISSes without SIM boards or consoles for your product? They will do it for you.)  They don't want to alienate that sales base.

Based on my work with the Serial Comms Protocol, I'd say that the communications from the ISS to the console is mature, as well as the console to PC or other hardware is stable and mature. As I recall without looking it up, they did apparently eliminate the ability to have more leaf/soil stations or something in order to stuff repeater battery status into an existing LOOP field.

I don't see any real work coming soon for any improved console. I suppose it works well enough for the majority of the customer base who are less interested in flashy looks that something familiar that works.

When they do innovate hardware rather than upgrade, (Vantage Connect) it's an add on to their existing product line. The Connect still uses a complete VP2 or VUE wireless weather station for the data.

OTOH, they seem to be becoming more interested in the commercial/ag market. I suppose Connect is supposed to be aimed there, as well as their 4 different IPM modules. Notice that they poured money into IPM programming rather than upgrading WeatherLink.

Even on their website now, Ag is listed above Academic and Home and Garden as markets.

Davis has certain engineering standards they seem to adhere to.  White ribbed boxes for electronics, ultra low power, monochrome displays etc.

So, after thinking about all that, I will go out on a limb and say that Davis is not going to do anything remarkable in the "Prosumer" weather station space in the near future. But, all that engineering talent they have (I know one personally, but we haven't spoken since he was hired, and I doubt he would tell me anything) must be doing something. I would say they are working on something more for ag. The existing wireless protocol is too limiting (Only 8 station IDs with too long of a range, and a limited weird mix of stations available to one console) to be really useful on a large ag operation.

So spoke out from the Connect, and maybe create an entirely new, incompatible wireless protocol with vastly more station numbers and station types. Future proof it as much as possible. New SIMs could replace existing ones in the same enclosures, if they are still good at power management.

One thing I think Davis is good at is keeping their cards close to their chest, something they learned from the Connect delay (and something that Acurite seems to be learning now. Look up what  happened to Osborne Computer in the 80s when they prematurely announced a new, faster/better/smaller/cheaper computer and their existing sales tanked.) 

And the delay in the introduction of the 2017 Davis catalog may be a clue that something new is on the way..)


Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #62 on: April 11, 2017, 02:38:52 PM »
Thanks - a fascinating read. I guess time will tell. Certainly, some of the background sounds very plausible, like Davis catering for a market that is much broader than hobbyists these days and the time and effort that seems to have gone into programming for the IPM products, for example.
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline dcriner

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 28
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #63 on: April 14, 2017, 08:43:16 PM »
I was nearly ready to buy a VP2, until the green dot fiasco
Maybe I've been asleep. What is the "green dot fiasco"? I've had a VP2 for about five years, and haven't heard of it or encountered it.
Doug

Offline miraculon

  • Sunrise Side Weather
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4107
  • KE8DAF
    • Sunrise Side Weather in Rogers City MI USA
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #64 on: April 15, 2017, 06:28:04 AM »
I was nearly ready to buy a VP2, until the green dot fiasco
Maybe I've been asleep. What is the "green dot fiasco"? I've had a VP2 for about five years, and haven't heard of it or encountered it.

Davis broke compatibility with the older loggers and the newer consoles a couple years back. Search WxForum for "green dot" and you will learn more than you ever wanted to know....

Greg H.


Blitzortung Stations #706 and #1682
CoCoRaHS: MI-PI-1
CWOP: CW4114 and KE8DAF-13
WU: KMIROGER7
Amateur Radio Callsign: KE8DAF

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #65 on: May 13, 2017, 05:08:16 AM »
OK, John, I'll take a shot... :) These comments are made with observation and input from reading this forum, as well as experience.

Your crystal ball seems to have been working well! Where did you buy it? I want one!
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Mattk

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2134
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #66 on: May 13, 2017, 05:56:01 AM »
WeatherLink.com continues to be locked in but starting to spread things around in the third party arena, finds some use for cabled systems but drops all VP2 wireless compatibility, pretty much on par.   

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #67 on: May 13, 2017, 06:09:41 AM »
The web API should be interesting, though I guess it will all be dealt with now via JSON (or XML) - it's the only logical way to deal with an almost unlimited number and variety of sensors.

As forecast by SLOweather, this is a move into new territory for Davis addressing the need for many-sensor remote monitoring. I don't see it as impacting significantly on the existing market for Vue/VP2 systems, at least for the next couple of years.

Incidentally, I was slightly tickled that EM was flagged up in this forum a year or so ago by tandy1000, but no-one AFAIK picked up on it:

http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=29484.msg289174
« Last Edit: May 13, 2017, 06:15:57 AM by johnd »
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Aardvark

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2305
  • Tonto to Lone Ranger : "never take off mask.
    • turned off
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #68 on: May 14, 2017, 09:14:20 AM »
One area that I have been commenting both to Davis on their FB page, emails,etc  is their failure to produce, revise any of their software. Particularly their Apple computer (mac and imac) software.  They seem to prefer to refer us to other people rather than themselves.  I am not sure if they do not have a code writer or that they just don't care. There exists a market out here of mac users that can only get the extreme basic information for the mac computer.  it sucks.

Weathercat seems to be about the only one that is written for the Mac population that is active.

Offline Jáchym

  • Meteotemplate Developer
  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 8605
    • Meteotemplate
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #69 on: May 14, 2017, 09:26:50 AM »
One area that I have been commenting both to Davis on their FB page, emails,etc  is their failure to produce, revise any of their software. Particularly their Apple computer (mac and imac) software.  They seem to prefer to refer us to other people rather than themselves.  I am not sure if they do not have a code writer or that they just don't care. There exists a market out here of mac users that can only get the extreme basic information for the mac computer.  it sucks.

Weathercat seems to be about the only one that is written for the Mac population that is active.

They either have a developer or could easily find one - but we are back to the original problem - why invest time and money if you have no competition. People will buy whatever is available because they have no other choice anyway...

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #70 on: May 14, 2017, 09:59:01 AM »
They either have a developer or could easily find one - but we are back to the original problem - why invest time and money if you have no competition. People will buy whatever is available because they have no other choice anyway...

Well, if you look at the EM data examples that are now visible on the Davis site you'll see where the Davis developer effort has been directed recently. The EM development was published yesterday though AIUI there have been some soft launches at a couple of US agricultural shows in the past month or two.

I wouldn't be surprised to see that same EM data presentation migrate to the Vue/VP2 arena sooner or later BICBW. As several of us has been saying for a while, I think Davis sees their primary data focus in the future as the cloud platform - purely IMO of course.

Edit: Here's one video link, for example: www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7qTj-fQRlY
« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 10:13:31 AM by johnd »
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Mattk

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2134
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #71 on: May 15, 2017, 08:20:39 PM »
This locking into the cloud stuff may be the flavour of the month but it does become very confined to what "they" decide is what you require. Not really a great deal of flexibility on offer so far.

And I would say what we see now with EM infrastructure is what will probably be rolled into the next wireless VP2 especially the mesh.

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #72 on: May 17, 2017, 03:16:11 AM »
I see that the switch has now been thrown at www.weatherlink.com/ so that everyone sees log-in options for both traditional (Vue/VP2/Connect) and EM parts of the site. (This log-in route was previously restricted access.)
« Last Edit: May 17, 2017, 03:18:13 AM by johnd »
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.

Offline Aardvark

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2305
  • Tonto to Lone Ranger : "never take off mask.
    • turned off
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #73 on: May 17, 2017, 12:27:53 PM »
I see that the switch has now been thrown at www.weatherlink.com/ so that everyone sees log-in options for both traditional (Vue/VP2/Connect) and EM parts of the site. (This log-in route was previously restricted access.)

Just wondering if there has to be something bought to get into their EM site or even if Davis would update the weatherlink site.

Offline johnd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 4826
    • www.weatherstations.co.uk
Re: Davis Facebook page requesting input on Vantage Pro 3
« Reply #74 on: May 17, 2017, 01:00:06 PM »
Just wondering if there has to be something bought to get into their EM site

Well, yes, buy an EM system and data plan (I've not heard anything to confirm that production units of EM are physically shipping as yet, but may be imminent). I don't know of any demo log-in if that's what you mean, though WL overview video in the Video Library tab of the EM section on the main Davisnet website gives a good idea of what's possible. There are other videos there that deal with the EM and Mobilize smartphone apps etc.

But remember that the price and mesh network of EM mean that it's intended more for larger farms and the like rather than individual hobbyists. I can't imagine that too many individuals will go for EM BICBW.

Quote
...or even if Davis would update the weatherlink site.

That's been speculated about upthread. I wouldn't personally be surprised if it were to happen at some point, though that's obviously a policy decision for Davis.

But when is another matter. I guess all the software development effort has been about getting EM v1.0 out of the door and very possibly there are further features yet to add. Switching traditional wl.com to the EM platform is presumably going to take at least some further development effort, depending on how much commonality there may be between the two platforms. And I guess that there's no spare resource available at present.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2017, 05:18:27 PM by johnd »
Prodata Weather Systems
Prodata's FAQ/support site for Davis stations
Includes many details on 6313 Weatherlink console.
UK Davis Premier Dealer - All Davis stations, accessories and spares
Cambridge UK

Sorry, but I don't usually have time to help with individual issues by email unless you are a Prodata customer. Please post your issue in the relevant forum section here & I will comment there if I have anything useful to add.