Topic: Software to decode SAME alerts over WU weather radio streams? Possible?

[LetterX]

Let me first say that I'm very new to weather monitoring, WU, this forum, etc., so please excuse my ignorance if it comes across that way.

While researching weather radios with SAME technology, I stumbled upon the Weather Undergound NWS radio streams.  It occurred to me how useful it would be if there were a software player for these streams that could decode SAME alerts.  For example, if there were an external popup player that you could program with SAME codes.  Or a third-party software player, or a winamp plugin, or something like that.  I don't know much about the technical aspects of SAME, and I'm not a programmer, so I don't know if this is even possible, but I think it would make the WU weather radio streams immensely more useful for a great many people/organizations.  Anyone with a net connection could be alerted to the localized weather issues of their choosing directly from the NWS streams, just like a weather radio with SAME.  Opinions?

[mackbig]

Possible, maybe. Probable, doubt it.  So many players, browsers etc, if you forced someone to get the applet that has been developed to pop with the streamer might not get many takers.  Also dont even know if the digital burst that turns on your all hazards radio's warning system could be decodedby the pc processing the stream.

However you could immediately implement a variation of what you are thinking.  Just embed the normal Noaa streamer on a web page that loads the an advisory script, one of Ken's (Saratoga WX) advisory scripts ( or his EC forecast script for Canada which includes watches and warning )  If you did that the visitor would see warnings for the area as they start the stream.  You could have it refresh in case a warning happened while they were online. 

But of course the disclaimer footnote at the bottom of most web sites is " Never base important decisions on this or any weather information obtained from the Internet."     Connections down, sites down, or behind, etc.

Andrew

[LetterX]

Like I said, I'm not an expert in any aspect of this, but there must be some sort of an open-source platform that would work for this.

Would your solution using Ken's advisory scripts be capable of distinguishing only specific alerts for specific sections of specific counties, the way the SAME system can?  For example:

Only flash-flood warnings for the south-central part of of Miami-Dade, Florida
Only tornado warnings for the southwest part of Dawes, Nebraska
Only high-wind warnings for the east-central part of Cascade, Montana

You get the idea.  The other thing I like about decoding the actual SAME data is that it would work in real-time and not rely on a refresh interval.  I'm really curious about whether it's technically possible to decode the SAME data on the listener's side of a digital audio stream, or whether the sound quality is just too poor for the data burst to be demodulated.

The other thing I'm wondering is whether the actual data that the NWS uses to create the SAME alerts is distributed in digital form.  That would obviously eliminate the entire need for an audio stream.  Does the NWS distribute this data in real-time in any form?

[BigOkie]

Like I said, I'm not an expert in any aspect of this, but there must be some sort of an open-source platform that would work for this.

Would your solution using Ken's advisory scripts be capable of distinguishing only specific alerts for specific sections of specific counties, the way the SAME system can?  For example:

Only flash-flood warnings for the south-central part of of Miami-Dade, Florida
Only tornado warnings for the southwest part of Dawes, Nebraska
Only high-wind warnings for the east-central part of Cascade, Montana

You get the idea.  The other thing I like about decoding the actual SAME data is that it would work in real-time and not rely on a refresh interval.  I'm really curious about whether it's technically possible to decode the SAME data on the listener's side of a digital audio stream, or whether the sound quality is just too poor for the data burst to be demodulated.

The other thing I'm wondering is whether the actual data that the NWS uses to create the SAME alerts is distributed in digital form.  That would obviously eliminate the entire need for an audio stream.  Does the NWS distribute this data in real-time in any form?

Actually, the SAME system can't discern from a part of a county or jurisdiction.  If a warning/watch exists in that jurisdiction anywhere, the code is triggered.  It's essentially based of the FIPS code system, which is done on a county by county basis (for the most part).

So you can't just extract a warning that's issued for the Central part of Miami-Dade.  If the central part of Miami-Dade county has a warning or a watch, then however you've programmed your SAME device to receive, will receive it.  As above, they're programmed based on SAME codes (which as above stated, are based on FIPS codes, which is essentially a coding for each county).

[LetterX]

Well, like I said, I don't know much about this, but this website seems to suggest that a SAME code can be issued to alert a specific area of a county:

http://www.nws.noaa.gov/nwr/samenz.htm

Perhaps it's possible, but not currently implemented?  Or am I just misunderstanding something?

[BigOkie]

Well, like I said, I don't know much about this, but this website seems to suggest that a SAME code can be issued to alert a specific area of a county:

http://www.nws.noaa.gov/nwr/samenz.htm

Perhaps it's possible, but not currently implemented?  Or am I just misunderstanding something?

But the problem is not what is being transmitted.  Can the receiver decode it properly?  Sofar, the two I've owned only decode the SAME code and not some special subdivider included with it.  So my same code specifically for my county is 40143 (Tulsa, OK).

One would think if it could, you could add the prefix to it.  A cursory search of SAME code subdivision implementation yielded no results.  I wonder if that was just a fart in the wind that never got off the ground.  Especially since the last modified date of the page you referred to indicates it was last updated in 2003.

One last edit:

It does appear that some SAME codes utilize the subdivision of counties.  AZ - 3 counties, MN - 3 counties, MT - 4 counties, SD - 1 county, WY - 1 county.  These all have mitigating circumstances.  Size and terrain specifically.

[LetterX]

It does appear that some SAME codes utilize the subdivision of counties.  AZ - 3 counties, MN - 3 counties, MT - 4 counties, SD - 1 county, WY - 1 county.  These all have mitigating circumstances.  Size and terrain specifically.

Okay, so possible but not widely used.  Makes sense, thanks.

I wonder if that was just a fart in the wind that never got off the ground.

URGENT - WEATHER MESSAGE
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE TULSA OK
ISSUED BY NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE NORMAN OK
1151 PM CDT WED JUL 14 2010

...THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN NORMAN OKLAHOMA HAS DETECTED A FART IN THE WIND THAT HAS MADE IT OFF THE GROUND...RESIDENTS IN THE FOLLOWING AREAS SHOULD SEEK SHELTER IN A STURDY STRUCTURE AND STAY AWAY FROM WINDOWS...


   Sorry.

[wuhu_software]

Check out this software:

http://www.dxsoft.com/en/products/seatty/

I contacted the author years ago about implementing S.A.M.E. and he implemented quickly. Reading his page, he apparently even saves the voice messages to the HD. While this was intended for use with HAM, I am pretty sure it would decode whatever is connected to your sound card. Pretty cool app. if you ask me.