Topic: My New WebCam

[DundeeWeather]

How did you end up with the camera and no visor?  I thought they were sold as a single unit.  I've never seen one shown without the visor.

Don't ask      Oh it came with one, but it magically got lost somewhere.

[racenet]

Okay, seriously thinking about getting a 15A.

A few questions.

1: How well do they work with IS with both static and streaming images?

2: Being that the 15A is not wireless and it will have to be placed in a location where running a cat5 cable to it is out of the question, what would be the best way to interface this into the wireless network? Power there isn't a problem.


Bob

[up10ad N9RJH]

Bob,  as you know, the 15A is the newer model of the 11A which I have and it works fine with IS.  The 15A commands are all the same.  I get static images and create time-lapse using IS but I use the internal web server for streaming.  I have disabled the pan, tilt and zoom, but you can turn it on if desired.  The 11A & 15A have great night capabilities!

[racenet]

Rick,

Thanks for the input. Makes me feel much better that it will work with IS without a problem.

As for my second question, being that I'm not really heavy into wireless (old fashioned wired type guy), if I mount the camera on an out building that has power, would I simply be able to hook the camera into a wireless access port there and have that access port connect to the wireless access port/router that is connected directly into the wired network? It would be a heck of a lot easier if I could run a cat5 cable out there, but that isn't possible.


Bob

[up10ad N9RJH]

Bob, I forgot to mention that I also use a Powerline Ethernet adapter with my other camera.  It is a Blekin  F5D4070 and you need 2 of them.  You plug one into the power at each location and they connect to the cam on the one end with an Ethernet drop and the router on the other.  It works very well.  They are $59 at Belkin and the lowest I have seen them is about $51 each.  Pricey solution but it works.
Both power sources need to be connected to the same main meter feed and there can't be a transformet between them.

[NoQuitters]

The 15A is POE compatible. Only need one adapter at the source end, such as out of the router. That is how mine is set up and it works great.

[racenet]

Rick,

Now that should work really well in this case. Thanks for the info!
The units don't need to be on the same circuit, just the same main feed, correct? Also, on the camera end, does this also provide the camera with power or is that a seperate feed?

Humm, wonder how well this would work under generator power.....



Bob

[racenet]

The 15A is POE compatible. Only need one adapter at the source end, such as out of the router. That is how mine is set up and it works great.

The problem with that is, I can't run a cat5 cable from the router to the camera. That is totally not doable. Router wise, does that require a special POE router or do most routers offer POE?


Bob

[NoQuitters]

The router is just a router. The POE is built into the camera and you use an adapter like the one Rick posted or the one I use, http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=332. You go from the router or modem or whatever source you are using to the adapter. Then from the adapter to the camera.

[up10ad N9RJH]

I think there is some tendency to think that power over ethernet (POE) and ethernet over power (EOP) are the same technology.  POE is used when you have a device like the camera at a location that you can reach with ethernet cable, but it has no power, like under a roof eave, etc.  EOP is good for locations where your device, like the camera, is at a location that has power, but would be a pain to run ethernet.  You can actually use EOP to get ethernet to devices in a shop or other building.  

Since you said that power is at the location where you want to put the camera, you don't need power over ethernet.  You put one of the ethernet over power units at your router location plugged into the router, and the other at your camera location plugged into the cam.  The ethernet signal then travels from your router location to your camera location over the power line of the house.

the EOP does not need to be on the same circuit, just the same meter.  The devices (both router and cam or whatever) do not even know that there isn't a real ethernet cable between them.

[racenet]

LOL

Now that I finally stopped my head from spinning.....

Okay, got the gist of all the POE & EOP stuff straight, so I know what needs to be done in that department.

One last network question and I think we can put this to bed.
With a mixture of wireless & wired networks, can 2 wireless access points connect directly to each other, wirelessly?

Let me run down the layout:

I have a wired network, with a cable modem, networked using a wired router, serving 6 machines. In that wired network, I also have wired in a wireless access point (wireless router set to access point mode). If I were to hang another wireless access point behind the camera, would that access point connect to the wireless access point already wired into the network, wirelessly or would it have to have to be actually wired into the network?

Hopefully I didn't muddy the water any further.  


Bob

[up10ad N9RJH]

Most Wireless access points can't connct to another access point wirelessly.  That would be nice because it would let you extend the range easily.  However,  some manufacturers do make a wireless repeater that uses different technology in order to do just that, repeat a wireless signal.  Not all WAPs are capable of repeating.

You can hook up a second access point to your wired network, preferably at a distance outside of the range of the first access point.  Wireless devices may then see both SSID's and can be told which to connect to (the one with the better signal).  

Bob, you have a significant network there, is it a business or just a big hobby?  

[Anole]

Most Wireless access points can't connct to another access point wirelessly.  That would be nice because it would let you extend the range easily.  However,  some manufacturers do make a wireless repeater that uses different technology in order to do just that, repeat a wireless signal.  Not all WAPs are capable of repeating.  

You have to be very careful when trying to setup bridging (AP<->AP connection) between access points. Some consumber APs are sold as being bridging capable but the truth is that they will only bridge with other APs from the same manufacturer and sometimes only with the exact same model and firmware version of AP. So if you want to tackle wireless bridging, do your homework before selecting your equipment.

Repeaters or range extenders are generally a better option as Rick points out. Some just plug into a wall outlet (like the Netgear WGXB102) others look more like regular APs and in some cases, APs themselves can be setup as repeaters.

[racenet]

Most Wireless access points can't connct to another access point wirelessly.

Yeah, I was afraid of that. So much for that idea. Was hoping it would be possible, since then I could use equipment I currently have on hand. Looks like the EOP adaptors are the only option.

Bob, you have a significant network there, is it a business or just a big hobby?  

LOL....I guess you could say a little of both. Was setup for the  BBS, way back when, which was taken down and replaced with the weather information/processing tasks. Actually, I just took down the last Lantastic segment of the network last month. Another great thing of the past put to bed. And of course, I have my business with the flag store and also domain registrations.


Bob

[dafuser]

...  I have a Toshiba IK-WB11A network camera and was going to see if I could get it to work somehow.

I am currently using a Toshiba WB11A camera, and the UPS man just delivered my Canon VB-C50iR and dome enclosure with heater and blower. I was disappointed to see the power and Ethernet cables coming out through the end of the wall mount. I see a spot where I can remove a small cap and run the Ethernet out through the small home. The power cord won't fit though the hole as the plug is too large.

How did you mount your VB-C50iR? Wall mount or pendant mount? I wonder if I can disconnect the other end of the power cable from the dome, run the power cord though the hole in the wall mount and reconnect it to the power supply. Then I could bolt the wall mount right to the side of my roof without drilling any extra holes to route the power and Ethernet cables.

[racenet]

Les,

Congrats on the new camera! I'm sure you will love it. From what I can see, it is a fantastic camera.

Later this spring I will be adding a new camera here and the possibilities are good that it will be a VB-C50iR. I was wondering if it would be possible for you to take some pictures of the uninstalled camera so I can see what I would be working with before hand, so there are no surprises such as the one you had. I'd like to see how they ran the cables, as you described above. If you could take a few shots and email them in my direction, that would be fantastic. My email address is support@nhweatherdata.com.

As for your question about disconnecting the cable, running it through the wall and then reattaching it, my answer would be, without actually seeing it, yes, you should be able to do that. I'm sure that cable can be removed if it needed to be replaced, so it should come apart easy enough.

Good luck with the install and make sure to let us know when you have it up and running, so we can check it out.


Bob

[dafuser]

Les,

Congrats on the new camera! I'm sure you will love it. From what I can see, it is a fantastic camera.

Later this spring I will be adding a new camera here and the possibilities are good that it will be a VB-C50iR. I was wondering if it would be possible for you to take some pictures of the uninstalled camera so I can see what I would be working with before hand, so there are no surprises such as the one you had. I'd like to see how they ran the cables, as you described above. If you could take a few shots and email them in my direction, that would be fantastic.

As for your question about disconnecting the cable, running it through the wall and then reattaching it, my answer would be, without actually seeing it, yes, you should be able to do that. I'm sure that cable can be removed if it needed to be replaced, so it should come apart easy enough.
Bob

Bob,

The photos are pretty big and so I posted them on one of my web sites where you can get a good look at them.  I put 10 photos up showing the camera and dome being unboxed. There are a couple of close shots showing the power and Ethernet cables running out the back of the wall mount. I also have another show showing the hole in the wall mount where you could run the power and Ethernet so they did not interfere with the wall mount installation.

http://homepage.mac.com/dafuser/PhotoAlbum37.html

[up10ad N9RJH]

Les, that C50i is a great cam, I mounted mine on the corner of the house so it has 270 degree field of view.  I used the corner mount bracket sold by Nuspectra where I got the cam.  It is awesome with that great analog zoom.  I'm assuming you got it all mounted ok, but if not, I may be able to help.

[racenet]

Thanks Les. Damn, that was better then Christmas morning!  

Seeing the pictures, yeah, I would say you could remove the power cable and reattach it once it is mounted. Sure would make for a smaller hole in the wall, that's for sure. Or, if you didn't feel comfortable messing with the insides taking it off, you could simple snip the plug off the end and replace it with a heavy duty, waterproof replacement plug. Doing it that way would also make removal a lot easier also.


Bob

[racenet]

Les, that C50i is a great cam, I mounted mine on the corner of the house so it has 270 degree field of view.  I used the corner mount bracket sold by Nuspectra where I got the cam.  It is awesome with that great analog zoom.  I'm assuming you got it all mounted ok, but if not, I may be able to help.

Rick,

Humm, now you got me thinking. With the corner mount, how far out does the dome acutally stand from the corner? The reason I ask is because of snow slide off the roof. Sure wouldn't want the dome to get caught up in one of those avalanches or I would be digging it out in the spring from the yard. They rumble the house like an earthquake!  


Bob

[dafuser]

Les, that C50i is a great cam, I mounted mine on the corner of the house so it has 270 degree field of view.  I used the corner mount bracket sold by Nuspectra where I got the cam.  It is awesome with that great analog zoom.  I'm assuming you got it all mounted ok, but if not, I may be able to help.

I have it all ready to mount, but the weather is not cooperating. Thunderstorms nearby,  and light drizzle right now. I don't want to be on a metal ladder at the present time

Forecast is rain for the next few days so I may have to wait a bit for the actual install.

With the wall mount, the center of the dome is about 10 inches from the wall. The done itself is 7 1/2 inches in diameter.

[up10ad N9RJH]

With the corner mount it still only sticks out from the wall about 12" or so.  My overhang is 24" but even a 12" would protect it I bet.  In the pic you may not be able to see but the bracket is mounted on the end of a log with two lag screws on each side.

Here is a pic:



Excuse the wiring nightmare, when this was taken I was in the process of running a separate power and Ethernet feed.  In the pic they are combined in one cable and the Ethernet isn't as robust as i'd like it using only 4 wires at half-duplex.

[racenet]

Okay, so it sticks out 12" diagonally, so that would be 6" from the straight line flat front. Humm, wonder if that would be enough to protect from the sliding snow. Darn, wish I had a overhang to put it under, instead of being right out in the open.    Guess I'll have to figure out a better place to do the mounting that is a little more protected.

Another question, since you delt with that company before. What does the cold weather kit consist of? Just a different heater/blower?


Bob

[dafuser]

Les, that C50i is a great cam, I mounted mine on the corner of the house so it has 270 degree field of view.  I used the corner mount bracket sold by Nuspectra where I got the cam.  It is awesome with that great analog zoom.  I'm assuming you got it all mounted ok, but if not, I may be able to help.

I'll post a picture of my installation tomorrow so you can see how I mounted my camera. I ended up routing my power and Ethernet out thru the small hole in the wall mount after I enlarged the hole enough to get the power cord plug through the hole.

I got the new camera installed and I really like the zoom on the Canon, but it can't compare to the low light ability of the Toshiba. Am I missing a setting or something, because the video is so dim as to be unusable once the sun goes down.

Do you have lights on at night around your yard? Your night video looks great compared to mine.

[up10ad N9RJH]

Bob, the cold weather kit is supposed to heat it and withstand a lower temp, but I didn't get the extra kit.  With the standard heater it was fine even when it was 15-20 below for days on end .

Les, you are right about the Toshiba working much better in low light.  The Canon has mediocre low-light capability but great zoom control.  I do have a sodium yard light near the house that helps the Canon when it is pointed in some areas, but I also use the VB Admin tools schedule program to turn on night mode (b&w) between sundown and sunset.  I also stop auto-patrol at night.