Author Topic: WS-1400 Anemometer  (Read 2446 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
WS-1400 Anemometer
« on: March 27, 2017, 02:35:18 PM »
I installed a new WS-1400-IP over the weekend and noticed the anemometer not moving at all when two other stations were moving. So I repositioned my WS-2080 right next the the WS-1400-IP. I've included a video that's hard to see but you can clearly see the WS-2080 registering wind when the WS-1400 is not. I'm going to monitor their wind speed graphs over the next 24 hours to see how they compare.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTs7Nr-G6Wg&feature=youtu.be

Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline 2Tall

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2017, 05:56:02 PM »
 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
I installed a new WS-1400-IP over the weekend and noticed the anemometer not moving at all when two other stations were moving. So I repositioned my WS-2080 right next the the WS-1400-IP. I've included a video that's hard to see but you can clearly see the WS-2080 registering wind when the WS-1400 is not. I'm going to monitor their wind speed graphs over the next 24 hours to see how they compare.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTs7Nr-G6Wg&feature=youtu.be


What a coincidence, I also installed a new WS-1400-IP over the weekend.  Two things I noticed with the anemometer; 1) It doesn't seem to move until the wind reaches a certain speed in spite of my mast measuring level all around with a post level.  When I can feel the wind blowing, I'm thinking that an anemometer should be moving. 2) When it moves fast, as in your video, is it just me or does the movement not appear to be completely symmetrical? Also, my anemometer and vane came already attached to the sensor housing.

I have it mounted on an old temporary 10ft mast for testing before I raise it to about 25 feet on a telescoping mast (see attachment).
« Last Edit: April 02, 2017, 03:29:43 PM by 2Tall »

Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2017, 10:56:40 PM »
So around 2pm today I mounted the WS-2080 (top graph) next to the WS-1400-IP (bottom graph). The WS-1400-IP clearly has a problem reporting wind speeds below 2 mph even though the specs say it will measure 0-100mph, where the WS-2080 is 0-112mph. I'm not happy with this issue on the 1400 and will be contacting Ambient Weather.

WS-2080 Specs
Wind Speed Range: 0 to 112 mph (operational)
Wind Speed Accuracy: ± 2.2 mph or 10% (whichever is greater)
Wind Speed Resolution: 0.1 mph

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]

WS-1400-IP Specs
Wind Speed Range: 0 to 100 mph (operational)
Wind Speed Accuracy: ± 2.2 mph or 10% (whichever is greater)
Wind Speed Resolution: 0.1 mph

 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]


Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2017, 10:39:19 AM »
I received a response today from Ambient. I can't say I'm overly pleased about their attitude on this matter. Since I happen to have a Davis Anemometer in the garage, I'm going to mount it next to the WS-1400-IP later today and see if what they are saying is correct.

----------------Response verbatim---------------------

Hi Kevin,

The resolution of the wind meter is about 2.4 mph and the lift off speed is about 2.2 mph. The lift off for example of a Davis Instruments is about 2 mph for the lift off speed and has a resolution of 1. The WS-2080 lift off speed was about 1 mph.

However, when you average over the 48 second update period, the results are not that different.

In fact, the WS-1400-IP tends to be more accurate at higher wind speeds than the Davis Instruments Vantage Vue and WS-2080.

Replacing the sensor array will not change your results. However, if you wish to return this weather station for refund, please visit:

www.AmbientWeather.com/rma.html

Regards,

Ed

-------------End of Response-------------------
Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2017, 01:37:34 PM »
In an effort to verify what I was being told by Ambient customer service, I mounted a Davis Anemometer next to the WS-1400-IP. I also placed my WM-2 hand held wind meter in the frame. You can clearly see two things in this video. The Davis Anemometer is registering winds on about the same as the WS-2080 while the WS-1400-IP is not. The WS-1400-IP does not start registering until an excess of 4mph winds are present and stops when they fall below ~3.5mph.

I will be returning my WS-1400-IP and I suggest anyone considering any Ambient Weather product using this sensor array, WS-1001 being one, know this limitation prior to purchasing.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E3gOQfTN4o[/youtube]
Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline dolfs

  • Senior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 64
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2017, 06:25:49 PM »
See some observations about this in my known problems thread.
--dolf

Ambient WS-1400-IP + MeteoBridge

Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2017, 09:51:43 AM »
What a coincidence, I also installed a new WS-1400-IP over the weekend.  Two things I noticed with the anemometer; 1) It doesn't seem to move until the wind reaches a certain speed in spite of my mast measuring level all around with a post level.  When I can feel the wind blowing, I'm thinking that an anemometer should be moving. 2) When it moves fast, as in your video, is it just me or does the movement not appear to be completely symmetrical? Also, my anemometer and vane came already attached to the sensor housing.

I have it mounted on an old temporary 10ft mast for testing before I raise it to about 25 feet on a telescoping mast (see attachment).

You might want to contact Ambient support. They dismissed my concerns until I showed them the video of the three anemometers together. Then they agreed to send me a new sensor unit (the whole outside unit). Yes, the cups and wind vane come already attached so it's not like you or I could have screwed things up assembling it.

I received my new sensor unit on Friday. It's been up and running since about mid day but we have had really strong winds since then so I can't really judge if it's performing any better at low winds. After a few days of data, I will post some plots comparing it to my WS-2080 again. However, in all of my research I'm discovering that I'll never have two anemometers showing close to the same data due to sampling rates and measuring formulas. My opinion on what I hear from the weather service on the data they collect is going from suspect to downright unreliable.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2017, 10:00:09 AM by kmahler »
Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline MrM1

  • North Central Florida
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 141
    • Bethel Weather
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2017, 11:55:32 PM »
To the OP, do you have an update since you received your new 1400 sensor?







Offline kmahler

  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
    • KO4JY WX
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2017, 12:53:31 AM »
To the OP, do you have an update since you received your new 1400 sensor?

I still don't like the 1400. But, I'll let you draw your own conclusions. Check out the data on wunderground.

KVANEWPO92 - The WS-1400
KVANEWPO75 - My older than dirt WS-2080
KVANEWPO93 - Davis VP2
KVANEWPO94 - Another Davis VP2

All anemometers are mounted at the same height within about a 4 foot circle.

Kevin
Kevin Mahler
Skywarn Storm Spotter, AKQ3785
CWOP AV286
73 de KO4JY


Offline dolfs

  • Senior Member
  • **
  • Posts: 64
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2017, 02:22:33 AM »
I haven't looked at your data, but are you sure that with those four, at the same level in a circle, one or more of them can be in the "wind-shadow" of one of the others, in particular with the dominant wind direction in your location. This could cause either unwanted blocking of the wind, or turbulent effects introduced by the first one hit by wind could have repercussions.

Not saying it is a problem, but I've been wondering about this, and if it is, how far apart they would need to be to avoid it.
--dolf

Ambient WS-1400-IP + MeteoBridge

Offline DoctorKnow

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1984
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2017, 07:51:38 AM »
I took a look. The 1400 thermometer is low, just like the station next to me. Also the wind is only showing for the 2080, none of the others are turning. The old 2080 wins! Humidity looks good on all. I am surprised the Davis isn't showing wind.

Offline dupreezd

  • Forecaster
  • *****
  • Posts: 512
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2017, 08:36:44 AM »
I had a look at the graphs for the 8th. I pulled the sample times of 93, 92 and 94 into a spreadsheet. Comparing the graphs is not a fair comparison as the data were not sampled at the same time.
 [ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
« Last Edit: June 09, 2017, 08:42:17 AM by dupreezd »
Davis VP2 6163 | WiFi Logger
CWOP - FW0717
Blitzortung 2100

Offline MrM1

  • North Central Florida
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 141
    • Bethel Weather
Re: WS-1400 Anemometer
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2017, 01:18:03 AM »
I looked at the 2 still reporting stations last night ... the Davis and the 1400 ... and there was also a 3 degree spread in temps with the Ambient reading cooler.   :shock:    That surprised me at night (or 1am EST).   Are the temp sensors that different all day long?

Not that it would help at night,  but I wonder if there is a way to improve the 1400s radiation shield around the temp sensor.  I am noticing slight temp spikes on mine in direct morning sunlight compared to another 1400 about 1.83 miles away and an AcuRite 5 n 1 about .7 miles away.  Both are lower than me in the morning by about 2 degrees.  But both are poorly mounted.
- the other 1400: down in a hole of low elevation, in a cluster of trees,  shaded almost all day.  The wind would be way off.  Temps might be ok by low elevation.
- the AcuRite is on a small lot surrounded by trees.  it is below the tree tops by several feet,  and is on the east side of the property so it too is not taking morning sun.
(both of these would have very poor wind and wind direction info and makes me wonder about WU's QC for wind and direction due to mount set ups)

My 1400 is 25ft off the ground mounted on the roof in a much more open area. The temp sensor is about 9 feet off the roof which is white metal. 

But as to 1400 mods ...
1.  would there be a way to modify the 1400s Anemometer for better resolution?
2.  would it be possible to modify (paint, insulate, etc) or replace the radiation shield with a larger shield?  I wounder if using one of the Ambient weather shields would improve unshaded temp readings and if you could get the larger sheild to fit onto the 1400 body







 

anything