WXforum.net
Weather Station Hardware => Davis Instruments Weather Stations => Topic started by: WxLover16 on June 17, 2017, 06:05:02 PM
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From the advice and suggestions from CW2274 (awesome guy), I just installed https://www.ebay.com/p/?iid=380794571711&lpid=82&&&ul_noapp=true&chn=ps into my VP2 (with the SHT 31), basically a high powered fan that is among the standards of what ASOS's use for official climate data. Since installing it, I can tell there is faster response time and will no doubt be greater accuracy. I recommend anyone who wants the absolute utmost in temp/humidity accuracy to upgrade to an A/C fan. Not only will you not have to worry about your fan motor dying (Davis uses cheap fans), it will run full bore 24/7 and you will get faster, more accurate temperatures all day every day. It's a win-win, IMO. So happy to have upgraded! \:D/
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Good deal. =D>
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From the advice and suggestions from CW2274 (awesome guy),
I agree, he helped me with advice on my build.
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I'm thinking of putting some underground wire to bring 120vAC out to a relatively clear spot (still not good enough for solar/uv all day long, too many trees within shadow distance) but wonder about other's experience with AC out to things electronic and fans runnning and all that for noise sources. I have some Blitzortung lightning detector stuff within a few hundred feet and don't want to have anything become a source of noise, or for any potential other sensors or station accoutrements that I migh hang out there where my wife won't see them.
What are any downsides to having AC where some things are collected together, even a Stevenson shelter for old theremometers, Taylor rain gauge, etc, vs maybe solar DC be better if I stuck up a 2x3' solar panel and a sealed box and battery in it?
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Glad you like the fan. I'm in the middle of my 2nd year with my Xerox drum fan running at 9V. I had the Davis fan cabled and running on 3V motors before that, but I much prefer the higher CFMs.
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I'm thinking of putting some underground wire to bring 120vAC out to a relatively clear spot
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What are any downsides to having AC where some things are collected together,
Of course, any active device like an AC powered fan is a potential noise source, but that's unlikely to bother other things - even lightning detectors within a reasonable distance.
However, if you run 110volt AC outside, make sure you do it in accordance with the electrical code. Among other things, that means have GFI/GFCI/AFCI protection for the entire run. Which means that you will probably also experience occasional times when the AC is "tripped" off. So, there will be no power. The most likely times for that to happen are when it's storming, lightning nearby, and/or raining.
For most applications, you're better off running lower-voltage DC (or lower-voltage AC).
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I note with interest that the fan shown on the referenced ebay webpage indicates this is a DC BRUSHLESS fan... They probably just grabbed an available image but it does make me wonder about their quality control...
Additionally, was this added to a Daytime fan upgrade or to the standard 24/7 model?
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Don, wouldn't a DC brushless motor be desirable? Your comment seemed to indicate a concern about quality control, and are you referring to the advertiser using any old image or about the quality of a brushless fan for that cheap?
Dale
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Agree with Dale any AC voltage like 120v needs protection like GFCI breakers. I'm actually behind 2 GFIC breakers at main house box where I installed 9 GFIC breakers on all circuits throughout home, expensive yes, cost was around $600 but being older home (1953) I'm not grounded on 1/2 circuits so for peace of mind, the GFCI breakers protect even on un-grounded circuits.
I've actually only had 1 breaker trip and it wasn't on the line going to Davis heater & fan. BTW its good idea for snow gauge heaters also like the Davis (110v) heater.
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I note with interest that the fan shown on the referenced ebay webpage indicates this is a DC BRUSHLESS fan... They probably just grabbed an available image but it does make me wonder about their quality control...
Additionally, was this added to a Daytime fan upgrade or to the standard 24/7 model?
I upgraded from the standard 24/7 model. Response time remarkable with this thing inside and can hear it running from like 10' away. It's ventilating beautifully!
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Glad you like the fan. I'm in the middle of my 2nd year with my Xerox drum fan running at 9V. I had the Davis fan cabled and running on 3V motors before that, but I much prefer the higher CFMs.
How many CFM's does your fan pull? I can literally feel the air exhausting out of the top plates on my shield. I love it. Perfectly aspirated!
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Glad you like the fan. I'm in the middle of my 2nd year with my Xerox drum fan running at 9V. I had the Davis fan cabled and running on 3V motors before that, but I much prefer the higher CFMs.
How many CFM's does your fan pull? I can literally feel the air exhausting out of the top plates on my shield. I love it. Perfectly aspirated!
I think it's about 60CFM at 12V, but again, I run mine at 9V. I was running it at 12V, but it won't start up after a power failure at that voltage. It'll restart on its own at 9V though. I got tired of losing power and forgetting to manually cycle up the voltage for the fan from 9 to 12 when it came back on.
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Glad you like the fan. I'm in the middle of my 2nd year with my Xerox drum fan running at 9V. I had the Davis fan cabled and running on 3V motors before that, but I much prefer the higher CFMs.
How many CFM's does your fan pull? I can literally feel the air exhausting out of the top plates on my shield. I love it. Perfectly aspirated!
I think it's about 60CFM at 12V, but again, I run mine at 9V. I was running it at 12V, but it won't start up after a power failure at that voltage. It'll restart on its own at 9V though. I got tired of losing power and forgetting to manually cycle up the voltage for the fan from 9 to 12 when it came back on.
Yes its about 60cfm, I'm running the same one also at 9v. Its now been in for 873 days 24/7 without issue. It's massively superior to Davis' rubbish fans (I went through four in under 2 years).
I never experienced the 12v startup issue, but just chose 9v to reduce the sound and not annoy the neighbours.
I think with a fan like this and an SHT31 sensor you have pretty much the 'ultimate' Davis setup.
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Don, wouldn't a DC brushless motor be desirable? Your comment seemed to indicate a concern about quality control, and are you referring to the advertiser using any old image or about the quality of a brushless fan for that cheap?
Dale
I was simply referring to the fact that the fan shown in the image is not the item they were selling and that, in a way, makes me wonder about their advertising quality control. But yes, a brushless DC motor would be better and safer to use providing it has similar quality and longevity of life. It would also be electrically quieter and less likely to interfere with any lightning detectors you may have in the area.
I run 110vac out to my VP2 weather station to run my rain gauge heater. It is on a GFIC circuit and has given me no problems of tripping over the several years it has been in operation.
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
Are you of the opinion that the 67 CFMs that my fan pulls (just like CW2274's) is too much?
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
Are you of the opinion that the 67 CFMs that my fan pulls (just like CW2274's) is too much?
Yes its way too much.
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20 or so is all it needs.
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
Are you of the opinion that the 67 CFMs that my fan pulls (just like CW2274's) is too much?
Yes its way too much.
Ok, so besides possibly drying out the humidity sensor, what adverse affects could it do? All I'm trying to do is get my readings as accurate as possible. You say too much can make sensor erratic, but wouldn't more air through the sensor chamber cause it to read ambient air faster and more efficient?
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Well erratic humidity readings will be the biggest issue. Eventually it will dry out to possibly 1% and you will wonder why.
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Well erratic humidity readings will be the biggest issue. Eventually it will dry out to possibly 1% and you will wonder why.
Ugh. I hope not. I live in a very humid climate (especially in summer). I guess I will have to watch and see if it keeps trending downward.
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Well erratic humidity readings will be the biggest issue. Eventually it will dry out to possibly 1% and you will wonder why.
BTW, how many CFM's does the stock fan run with no batteries? Just wondering if you knew.
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Well erratic humidity readings will be the biggest issue. Eventually it will dry out to possibly 1% and you will wonder why.
BTW, how many CFM's does the stock fan run with no batteries? Just wondering if you knew.
I calculated it out once figuring diameter, inlet and outlet of chamber its around 5-7cfm if math was correct. So 10-20 is absolutely all needed.
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Well erratic humidity readings will be the biggest issue. Eventually it will dry out to possibly 1% and you will wonder why.
BTW, how many CFM's does the stock fan run with no batteries? Just wondering if you knew.
I calculated it out once figuring diameter, inlet and outlet of chamber its around 5-7cfm if math was correct. So 10-20 is absolutely all needed.
I was using one battery to get some nightime aspiration as well, so I suppose I could knock those numbers in half for what I was pulling. IDK. My climate is rainy, humid in summer so I probably will most definitely know if my humidity is suffering from error. I just love the added aspiration. My response time now is so much better it seems too. Perhaps not totally needed, but I love it.
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Dendrite mentioned that he uses a fan that pulls around 47 CFM. I would wonder if he ever had issues with his humidity reading too low.
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Dendrite mentioned that he uses a fan that pulls around 47 CFM. I would wonder if he ever had issues with his humidity reading too low.
Ask him, CW may be unique but my test have shown much less airflow is needed.
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Remember a rating of fan is designed for same size chamber anything larger changes what fan outputs.
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Dendrite mentioned that he uses a fan that pulls around 47 CFM. I would wonder if he ever had issues with his humidity reading too low.
no issues. I tend to run more humid than the local ASOS. Here's my MADIS page.
http://weather.gladstonefamily.net/site/C7324
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Dendrite mentioned that he uses a fan that pulls around 47 CFM. I would wonder if he ever had issues with his humidity reading too low.
no issues. I tend to run more humid than the local ASOS. Here's my MADIS page.
http://weather.gladstonefamily.net/site/C7324
So do I. My closest ASOS always seems to read a few degrees too low for some reason.
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Not sure how the ASOS gets humidity now. It use to use the mirror by chilling down until dew formed on mirror. Lots more accurate I would think if calibrated correctly, that's a big if however because I've seen fog you could cut with a knife and ASOS DP reported low 90's.
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Not sure how the ASOS gets humidity now. It use to use the mirror by chilling down until dew formed on mirror. Lots more accurate I would think if calibrated correctly, that's a big if however because I've seen fog you could cut with a knife and ASOS DP reported low 90's.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_airport_weather_station
It's now the Vaisala DTS-1
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I'll throw in this paper on the DTS-1 too...
https://ams.confex.com/ams/pdfpapers/53362.pdf
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Not sure how the ASOS gets humidity now. It use to use the mirror by chilling down until dew formed on mirror. Lots more accurate I would think if calibrated correctly, that's a big if however because I've seen fog you could cut with a knife and ASOS DP reported low 90's.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_airport_weather_station
It's now the Vaisala DTS-1
Thanks for that. It reads for others quote:
Due to problems with the chilled mirror sensor, NWS ASOS sites now use Vaisala's DTS1 sensor, which measures humidity only via capacitance. The sensor is based on a solid state capacitive relative humidity element that incorporates a small heater so that the sensing element is always above the ambient temperature, eliminating the formation of dew or frost. The sensor reports directly in dew point through a calculation based on measured relative humidity and the measured temperature of the heated capacitive element.
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I've been offline for a while, so obviously haven't replied, but thanks to those with the kind words.
As far as questions about the fan WxLover and I use, it is rated for 70,000 hrs (about 8 years) of continuous use in temps well above even what I get, and mine has been in perfect continual use for two years. As far as drying out the sensor, truly couldn't say, but the 31 does drop quickly when it gets to about 3-4%, (as I've stated in another thread) compared to the ASOS's around me, but I've found that acceptable considering it absolutely rocks above that. Even <3% is not too common here, so I can live with it, especially when compared to my SHT11 and 15. The 67 CFM is not too much IMHO (I think my obs prove that), as long as the fan is NOT sealed in, but it absolutely need not that much power to be effective. I chose this fan not just for it's performance in my heat, but the red LED located on the ISS that tells me the fan is getting power 24/7, so I'll know if the GFI has tripped. Very convenient! The ONLY downside is more cleaning of the sensor and chamber. I'll take it!
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How did you mount it? Is the fan good for outdoor locations?
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
Are you of the opinion that the 67 CFMs that my fan pulls (just like CW2274's) is too much?
Too much? Pshaw! I too was concerned with the reliability and underperformance of the piddly little fan in a stock FARS setup. So I'm now I'm running duplex alternating 240V, 2HP squirrel cage blowers on a custom built stainless steel plenum. Of course I've got the whole shebang tied in to my standby generator. At 500 CFS apiece we are talking serious responsiveness!
Overkill? Maybe. But the fine variations in temperature changes I can monitor with this setup make it all worth it. If a gnat farts within so much as 10' of the intake I'm gonna know about it!
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Really everyone the shield itself is very efficient and only needs so much air flow to work properly. These shields are as good as RM Young but going with to much airflow can cause problems. I've tried to get CW to reduce airflow. If going with a outside AC or DC fan go with the minimum airflow type fan.
Too much can make sensor erratic and dry out humidity sensor (wear out sensor) prematurely.
I'm okay with a outside fan, I was one of the originators if not the first to use electric fan back in 90's but don't go overboard. The Davis aspirated shield works very well with just the solar powered DC fan, going much higher brings up issues.
Are you of the opinion that the 67 CFMs that my fan pulls (just like CW2274's) is too much?
Too much? Pshaw! I too was concerned with the reliability and underperformance of the piddly little fan in a stock FARS setup. So I'm now I'm running duplex alternating 240V, 2HP squirrel cage blowers on a custom built stainless steel plenum. Of course I've got the whole shebang tied in to my standby generator. At 500 CFS apiece we are talking serious responsiveness!
Overkill? Maybe. But the fine variations in temperature changes I can monitor with this setup make it all worth it. If a gnat farts within so much as 10' of the intake I'm gonna know about it!
I have a good sarcasm detector, but even I'm not sure on this one. I never put anything past people on here. ;)
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females never pass gas.
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How did you mount it? Is the fan good for outdoor locations?
It was an easy mount. I simply had to shave off around 1/8th" of two bottom sides and it fit right in where the old Davis stock fan sat. It's good for outdoors if you water-proof it enough. Unfortunately, apparently I did not quite go the distance in sealing it well enough and it quit on me a few days ago after a heavy rain so I had to order another one. :roll: ](*,)
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Don't ask how I know this :oops:, but look at the picture.
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How did you mount it? Is the fan good for outdoor locations?
Unfortunately, apparently I did not quite go the distance in sealing it well enough and it quit on me a few days ago after a heavy rain so I had to order another one. :roll: ](*,)
As I said in a PM to you, since your GFI didn't trip, the connection didn't short, it must have a break in it somewhere. Regardless, neither would cause the fan motor itself to fail. I'm betting it still works just fine unless it burned up from binding, which we also spoke of.
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Don't ask how I know this :oops:, but look at the picture.
Then his GFI would have tripped.
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Is that not a 12V fan? GFI will only trip if there is a patch to ground.
I am just pointing out where water could have come in as has happened to me.
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Is that not a 12V fan? GFI will only trip if there is a patch to ground.
I am just pointing out where water could have come in as has happened to me.
It is, but 120V is run out to a transformer hooked to the fan.
Yes, water certainly could get in there, but besides wrecking the fan, would that not trip the GFI?
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A power supply isolates AC ground (building) from DC ground, especially on switching power supplies such computer supplies.
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A power supply isolates AC ground (building) from DC ground, especially on switching power supplies such computer supplies.
So I guess that means "no". If that's the case, then maybe this is indeed what happened causing the failure because I've been ](*,) trying to help him figure out why it quit.
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
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If you want to skip the DC conversion I use AC model: https://www.coolerguys.com/products/mechatronics-80-x-25mm-ac-115v-fan-uf80b12-bth good for very low temps I experience in -30F range.
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Looks like a pretty good fan. 24cfm at 3100rpm and ONLY 35dB. That is quiet.
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Works well I've never had any AC fans fail over several years but every 4-5 years I swap out and put new units in. If anyone gets AC fan remember to add plug to order.
Good idea only run these outside on GFCI circuit should outside/garage circuit not have one already they sell extensions with GFCI built-in.
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
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Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
Wait I'm lost. How does that solve my problem? What does that mean?
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
Wait I'm lost. How does that solve my problem? What does that mean?
Not saying it does solve your problem. IF water got into the fan assembly itself, it could have destroyed the motor WITHOUT tripping the GFI. That part I did not know was possible. However, this means with your new motor properly sealed as 'dupreezd' shows, it MAY fix the problem. With your lack of knowledge in this area and how you relate it to us can make trouble shooting very difficult.
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
Wait I'm lost. How does that solve my problem? What does that mean?
Not saying it does solve your problem. IF water got into the fan assembly itself, it could have destroyed the motor WITHOUT tripping the GFI. That part I did not know was possible. However, this means with your new motor properly sealed as 'dupreezd' shows, it MAY fix the problem. With your lack of knowledge in this area and how you relate it to us can make trouble shooting very difficult.
That is an understatement for sure! I am going to be pissed if something like this happens again with the new fan!
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
Wait I'm lost. How does that solve my problem? What does that mean?
Not saying it does solve your problem. IF water got into the fan assembly itself, it could have destroyed the motor WITHOUT tripping the GFI. That part I did not know was possible. However, this means with your new motor properly sealed as 'dupreezd' shows, it MAY fix the problem. With your lack of knowledge in this area and how you relate it to us can make trouble shooting very difficult.
That is an understatement for sure! I am going to be pissed if something like this happens again with the new fan!
This is not rocket surgery. You, we, us, will get it eventually. [-o<
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In this picture you can see the separation.
You are right, the GFI will not trip if anything goes wrong on the DC side such as letting the smoke out the components. :-)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Thank you for the clarification. Hopefully this will solve his problem cause I'm out of ideas. :?
Wait I'm lost. How does that solve my problem? What does that mean?
Not saying it does solve your problem. IF water got into the fan assembly itself, it could have destroyed the motor WITHOUT tripping the GFI. That part I did not know was possible. However, this means with your new motor properly sealed as 'dupreezd' shows, it MAY fix the problem. With your lack of knowledge in this area and how you relate it to us can make trouble shooting very difficult.
That is an understatement for sure! I am going to be pissed if something like this happens again with the new fan!
This is not rocket surgery. You, we, us, will get it eventually. [-o<
Like you said, when you're dealing with someone with no real knowledge in this area, it damn near can be rocket surgery! I have basically come up with everything in my mind that could have gone wrong (as have you), double checked everything. Talk about extremely frustrating! I just want a fan for my FARS again! New fan should be here tomorrow.
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After replacing the fan when it is still on the ground, without powering it up, give it a good soaking with a water hose. Start at the bottom and work your way up until you see water getting in, or not getting in.
Also, Google "cable drip loop".
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After replacing the fan when it is still on the ground, without powering it up, give it a good soaking with a water hose. Start at the bottom and work your way up until you see water getting in, or not getting in.
Also, Google "cable drip loop".
I will definitely seal the cable that goes to the PCB plus do a drip loop. At this point I will do anything to keep it running.
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Well, feels like deja vu for me. Just installed, again, the same AC fan into my VP2. Here's to hoping it doesn't crap out like the last one or I will just have to say I have the worst luck. LOVE the temperature response again, especially after taking it apart and cleaning it while waiting for the new fan in the mail. Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
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Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
61 CFM probably sucked water right into the fan. With 3+ times what's necessary airflow expect issues.
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Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
61 CFM probably sucked water right into the fan. With 3+ times what's necessary airflow expect issues.
Please....
I hose off my VP2 from the SIDE and the fan doesn't bat an eyelash.
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Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
61 CFM probably sucked water right into the fan. With 3+ times what's necessary airflow expect issues.
Well this time I sealed with caulk the 2 cables going directly into the fan's PCB. Hopefully I won't have any issues.
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Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
61 CFM probably sucked water right into the fan. With 3+ times what's necessary airflow expect issues.
Please....
I hose off my VP2 from the SIDE and the fan doesn't bat an eyelash.
Then I just wonder how/why mine decided to take the ride to fan heaven after only a few days. :? ](*,)
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Almost looks good as new with a 67 cfm fan and a 31!
BTW, about the last fan, when I took it out and plugged the fan directly into outlets inside, it still didn't work. That would suggest that water somehow got into the motor and destroyed it, right?
61 CFM probably sucked water right into the fan. With 3+ times what's necessary airflow expect issues.
Please....
I hose off my VP2 from the SIDE and the fan doesn't bat an eyelash.
Then I just wonder how/why mine decided to take the ride to fan heaven after only a few days. :? ](*,)
Who knows, may not have even been water related.
And when I say hose off, I mean full blast. A Cat 5 would have a hard time duplicating that much sideways rain. :-)
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If I do decide to install a 67CFM fan into my VP2, how would I do it? Would the fan work with the power provided by the VP2 station itself or would I need another source of power?
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If I do decide to install a 67CFM fan into my VP2, how would I do it? Would the fan work with the power provided by the VP2 station itself or would I need another source of power?
If you want anything bigger than the stock motor, you'll need a/c power from somewhere.
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Well, after a 4.30"/hr rain rate storm, my fan quit working, AGAIN! Basically everytime it pours, it quits. I don't understand it, maybe my climate is too wet for an electric fan or something. This really pisses me off. I guess it's back to the stock fan. :evil: ](*,)
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maybe my climate is too wet for an electric fan or something.
No.
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I am really sorry to hear that. Do you know where the rain comes in?
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I am really sorry to hear that. Do you know where the rain comes in?
Hell if I know. I thought I sealed it good enough this time. Apparently water is coming in SOMEWHERE, just can't figure it out. Not sure if I'm willing to spend the $$ for another. Might just go back to stock.
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Send me some close up pictures so I can have a look. Two eyes better than one
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Send me some close up pictures so I can have a look. Two eyes better than one
Once I take the shield apart tomorrow to put the stock back in I will take pics. I think perhaps I should have sealed around the LED which I didn't/didn't think to.
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I sent you a link of lower 24 CFM AC and and optional 20 CFM DC that will work.
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This is the AC fan I'm now running since Cooltron stopped making the low temperature rated fan. These are ball bearing fans rated -40C to 70C size 80x80x25.
PDF fan specs: http://datasheet.octopart.com/UF80B12-BTH-Mechatronics-datasheet-43730124.pdf
Cooler guys sells the fan here: https://www.coolerguys.com/products/mechatronics-80-x-25mm-ac-115v-fan-uf80b12-bth
They do have speed controller option if 24 CFM is still too much option. Cord is separate purchase not included.
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
This is in a new DFARS enclosure and a with a new SHT31 temp/hum sensor (required -0.9 correction applied to all consoles). At 24 cfm, it's relatively quiet. You start to hear it from maybe five or six feet away.
I read elsewhere on this forum that the corners of the fan would need to be slightly shaved in order for it to fit into the fan chamber. I used a hand-held file on each corner of the aluminum frame:
(http://i.imgur.com/V8KxFJw.jpg)
Installed in DFARS with a tight fit:
(http://i.imgur.com/9PyuIOz.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/lpWeH4Z.jpg)
Final installation:
(http://i.imgur.com/f7LRrwG.jpg)
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
This is in a new DFARS enclosure and a with a new SHT31 temp/hum sensor (required -0.9 correction applied to all consoles). At 24 cfm, it's relatively quiet. You start to hear it from maybe five or six feet away.
I read elsewhere on this forum that the corners of the fan would need to be slightly shaved in order for it to fit into the fan chamber. I used a hand-held file on each corner of the aluminum frame:
(http://i.imgur.com/V8KxFJw.jpg)
Installed in DFARS with a tight fit:
(http://i.imgur.com/9PyuIOz.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/lpWeH4Z.jpg)
Final installation:
(http://i.imgur.com/f7LRrwG.jpg)
Awesome job, looks great. =D>
I've done the file corners also but only do the 4-lower (toward sensor) so I can wedge fan in without movement.
Operating temp on your fan is 14 to 230°F. 22 CFM should work perfect at full speed. It will probably work below 14° but just not at rated capacity plus at those temps it won't be needed as much.
http://www.acinfinity.com/axial-ac-fan-kits/axial-8025-muffin-115v-ac-cooling-fan-80mm-x-80mm-x-25mm/
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That's probably the most professional PWS setup I've seen on this board. You should be proud of your work, I sure as hell would be. =D>
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
This is in a new DFARS enclosure and a with a new SHT31 temp/hum sensor (required -0.9 correction applied to all consoles). At 24 cfm, it's relatively quiet. You start to hear it from maybe five or six feet away.
I read elsewhere on this forum that the corners of the fan would need to be slightly shaved in order for it to fit into the fan chamber. I used a hand-held file on each corner of the aluminum frame: [...snip...]
Awesome job, looks great. =D>
I've done the file corners also but only do the 4-lower (toward sensor) so I can wedge fan in without movement.
Operating temp on your fan is 14 to 230°F. 22 CFM should work perfect at full speed. It will probably work below 14° but just not at rated capacity plus at those temps it won't be needed as much.
http://www.acinfinity.com/axial-ac-fan-kits/axial-8025-muffin-115v-ac-cooling-fan-80mm-x-80mm-x-25mm/ (http://www.acinfinity.com/axial-ac-fan-kits/axial-8025-muffin-115v-ac-cooling-fan-80mm-x-80mm-x-25mm/)
Thanks! .. I started out filing down just the lower four corners, but I struggled getting it to slide down into the chamber. I was finally able to get a perfect tight fit doing all eight - but, you're right, there was a risk of over doing it. Lucked out on that one. Though, I suppose I could have inserted a strip or two of electrical tape along the corners to tighten it up if that had been necessary.
Hum.. I guess my Celsius conversion was wrong.. I thought this fan was rated for a lower temp. I'm close to 7000ft and we'll get below 14°F several times in the winter... it'll be fun to see if she can take it! .. I'll report back in Jan.
Again, thanks for your help with finding a suitable AC fan for this project.
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That's probably the most professional PWS setup I've seen on this board. You should be proud of your work, I sure as hell would be. =D>
Thank you very much! ... I'll have many more details about the installation when I -finally- -some day- finish the web site (http://www.herains.com).
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
This is in a new DFARS enclosure and a with a new SHT31 temp/hum sensor (required -0.9 correction applied to all consoles). At 24 cfm, it's relatively quiet. You start to hear it from maybe five or six feet away.
I read elsewhere on this forum that the corners of the fan would need to be slightly shaved in order for it to fit into the fan chamber. I used a hand-held file on each corner of the aluminum frame:
(http://i.imgur.com/V8KxFJw.jpg)
Installed in DFARS with a tight fit:
(http://i.imgur.com/9PyuIOz.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/lpWeH4Z.jpg)
Final installation:
(http://i.imgur.com/f7LRrwG.jpg)
Excellent job :)
Regards to the WeMo you said it can IFTTT, eg winds < xxMPH etc, i take it this isnt winds from your own station
but perhaps the local forecast or something?
Just read up on them, it says it can read from any data source on the net :shock: so in theory it can read our stations
data from our websites?
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). [...snip...]
Excellent job :)
Regards to the WeMo you said it can IFTTT, eg winds < xxMPH etc, i take it this isnt winds from your own station
but perhaps the local forecast or something?
Thank you.
Using the Meteobridge I have connected to my console, I can construct an event trigger based on data from my wx station (temp, wind, rain, etc), along with (optionally) time/date variables, which, when triggered, will send an email or text to IFTTT commanding the WeMo Smart Plug to turn on/off.
The same should be possible with any wx software (WeatherCat, Weather Display, Cumulus, etc.) that features sensor triggers and email/text alerts.
I use a variation of this method to turn my rain bucket heater on/off when in starts/stops to snow (http://www.wxforum.net/index.php?topic=1468.msg238844#msg238844). But in this case, it uses IFTTT's "current conditions" feature instead of actual data from my station. This is because after two-years of observations, I was unable to construct a sensor trigger that, by itself, could reliably fire when it was actually snowing. Since IFTTT switched to WeatherUnderground for its weather service a couple years ago, the "current conditions" snow trigger works very well (for my area).
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Thank you for the reply,
Ideally i am wanting to, If sunset, reduce voltage, if sunrise revert but i dont think thats possible?
That idea is to slow the fan in the shield
Scrub the above, thats not possible now i've thought about it, but i wonder if this (https://www.amazon.co.uk/WeMo-Maker-Voltage-Automation-Controller/dp/B01I8N1ODM/ref=sr_1_1?s=diy&ie=UTF8&qid=1500097722&sr=1-1&keywords=WeMo+Maker)is
Are you saying it could, read my leaf wetness data from an email from WD, if leaf wetness >1 turn on plug
I am trying to automate my to reduce power consumption, my leaf is not actually for that, its used
as a rain duration sensor (activates rain icon as soon as >1) and i have a heater in there so its
responsive when it stops raining, at the moment its on 24/7
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
How does a fan "artificially dry the air"? The air is the air. Plain and simple. This is a basic underlying principle of that which we are trying so hard to observe.
It cracks me up a bit "ooooh a little fan is good so a bigger fan must be better... but not too big or it will artificially dry the air" with no real understanding of what it is that is going on.
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I just installed the AC fan referenced above per @ValentineWeather's suggestion (thanks for your help by the way). I have it plugged into a WeMo wifi switch, so I can easily turn the fan on/off manually via the Internet .. and automatically via parameters, such as, "fan off IF avg-wind >20 AND time-of-day = night" (but as of now, I plan to leave it on 24/7). You can quickly see the temps rise when it's switched off, even in a 10-15mph breeze. Interestingly, during a rain storm last night, the humidity increased with the fan on and decreased with it off (for some reason, I thought the fan might decrease humidity by artificially drying the air). So, the fan really does a good job.
How does a fan "artificially dry the air"? The air is the air. Plain and simple. This is a basic underlying principle of that which we are trying so hard to observe.
It cracks me up a bit "ooooh a little fan is good so a bigger fan must be better... but not too big or it will artificially dry the air" with no real understanding of what it is that is going on.
Instead of mocking, educate us so we can learn?
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A follow-up on my fan install.. The AC fan pictured in my previous post turned out to be the wrong one. Amazon switched fans, but kept the same product link (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009OXSFBA), and I didn't look closely at the specs. It's only rated for +14F (-10C). I need a fan that can handle lower temps. (Thanks @ValentineWeather for pointing this out!)
Also, while I had it installed, I noticed my temps where running high. Using an infrared gun, I checked the fan motor temperature while it was running - it read 110-115F. I realized I should not have the fan placed so far down the fan housing as it put the motor within an inch of the temp sensor. I moved it to the top of the opening and temps were more normal.
But, since I needed a new fan anyway, I wanted to try out a DC fan instead, as I had read here they run cooler.
I decided on the Noctua NF-A8 ULN (https://www.amazon.com/Noctua-NF-A8-ULN-Premium-80mm/dp/B00NEMGCRQ) fan. This is a high-quality whisper-quiet fan that can run at two speeds, 20 CFM (1400 RPM) or 15 CFM (1100 RPM), (which is close to the standard Davis DC fan speed). The motor temp after one hour of operation was 68F, basically ambient temp - much lower than AC fans. Operating tolerance is rated at -4F (-20C), (which is better, but still may not be able to handle winter temps here - we'll see).
Only the lower corners of the fan frame were filed-down this time. The upper corners were left intact so that the fan rests on top of the fan opening. I used metal tape instead of rope caulk to seal around the fan. The Lunar Module:
(http://i.imgur.com/07h22LR.jpg)
Because DC fans require a power adapter (https://www.coolerguys.com/collections/ac-dc-external-power-supply/products/110v-ac-to-12v-dc-power-supply-with-4-pin-molex-500ma), it was necessary to install a weather-proof enclosure near the DFARS. (A 24in 3-pin fan extension cable (https://www.coolerguys.com/products/3-pin-fan-cable-extension-12-thru-72-inches) was also needed.):
(http://i.imgur.com/yH98AVe.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/B7QAQJs.jpg)
If it turns out this fan can't handle winter temps here, after much searching, I found a 80mm 12v DC fan, NMB 08015JE-12M-BA-F0 (https://www.arrow.com/en/products/08015je-12m-ba-f0/nmb-technologies-corporation), 22 CFM, that is meant for installation in freezers and is rated for -40F (-40C) on the low end (but only 104F (40C) on the high end - so possibly not suited for hot areas). (Also, if desired, fan speed for 12v fans such as this one can be reduced using a resistor cable (https://www.coolerguys.com/collections/switch-thermal-variable-control-cables/products/3-pin-pass-through-resistor-rpm-reducer) (Noctua includes one of these with the fan shown above).)
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=D>
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Interesting about the fan temperatures being so high on the one fan. I'll test the old Cooltron model no longer available and the Mechatronics UF80B12 BTH and report back. I'm letting fans get down to room temperature currently.
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Interesting about the fan temperatures being so high on the one fan. I'll test the old Cooltron model no longer available and the Mechatronics UF80B12 BTH and report back. I'm letting fans get down to room temperature currently.
FYI: When I hit the fans with the infrared gun, I found out you get two different temp readings for each side of the fan. The intake side, which is the side facing the temp sensor, runs much hotter than the exhaust side. Therefore, my tests were done with the fans uninstalled so I could access both sides of the fans. Reported temps are for the hotter intake side after one hour of operation.
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The Mechatronics UF80B12 BTH rated at -40c is running warmer than Cooltron FA8025-51 rated at -20c. Bearing temperatures started at 73F and rose to 96F Mechatronics, Cooltron 86F on inlet side.
I really don't think it's an issue unless mounting sensor overly close to fan. I've been running the warmer Mechatronics since last year side by side with Davis and on cold days even below 0F they ran close the biggest difference was response time.
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You folks realize that putting anything the generates heat... INSIDE the chamber (or even in the path of the airflow)... is the antithesis of what they are trying to accomplish with all that shielding.
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You folks realize that putting anything the generates heat... INSIDE the chamber (or even in the path of the airflow)... is the antithesis of what they are trying to accomplish with all that shielding.
IF the fan was located underneath the sensor in the chamber, I'd completely agree, and would never buy such a poor design. Exactly why the fan is positioned the way it is, heat rises, and the fan surely helps the process by sucking it's own heat (which in my case and probably most others, is non-existent for arguments sake) away from the sensor.
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You folks realize that putting anything the generates heat... INSIDE the chamber (or even in the path of the airflow)... is the antithesis of what they are trying to accomplish with all that shielding.
IF the fan was located underneath the sensor in the chamber, I'd completely agree, and would never buy such a poor design. Exactly why the fan is positioned the way it is, heat rises, and the fan surely helps the process by sucking it's own heat (which in my case and probably most others, is non-existent for arguments sake) away from the sensor.
Exactly it's not an issue I can see unless its extreme heat. Even at -28F I'm seeing no difference in sensor temperatures between the solar and AC fan other than speed of sensor change the AC always responds quicker to changes.
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You folks realize that putting anything the generates heat... INSIDE the chamber (or even in the path of the airflow)... is the antithesis of what they are trying to accomplish with all that shielding.
IF the fan was located underneath the sensor in the chamber, I'd completely agree, and would never buy such a poor design. Exactly why the fan is positioned the way it is, heat rises, and the fan surely helps the process by sucking it's own heat (which in my case and probably most others, is non-existent for arguments sake) away from the sensor.
Heat does not explicitly rise. Or the sun would not warm us, no?
Radiant heat radiates in all directions from the source. It's right there in the name even: Fan Aspirated RADIATION Shield.
But carry on. You guys look like you are having fun.
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Perhaps, but then wouldn't the fan suck out any heat created fron the fan.
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Perhaps, but then wouldn't the fan suck out any heat created fron the fan.
I think what you are trying ask is does the increase in convection offset the radiation. It may or may not. That's math.
Stand under one of those infrared heaters at the bus stop on a cold windy day. Can you still feel the heat?
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Pass, we dot have such luxuries :D
I think the suction far out weighs any fan heat, most certainly in regards to mine
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You folks realize that putting anything the generates heat... INSIDE the chamber (or even in the path of the airflow)... is the antithesis of what they are trying to accomplish with all that shielding.
IF the fan was located underneath the sensor in the chamber, I'd completely agree, and would never buy such a poor design. Exactly why the fan is positioned the way it is, heat rises, and the fan surely helps the process by sucking it's own heat (which in my case and probably most others, is non-existent for arguments sake) away from the sensor.
Heat does not explicitly rise. Or the sun would not warm us, no?
Apparently your physics class was different than mine. Maybe this will help. http://www.mansfieldct.org/schools/MMS/staff/hand/convcondrad.htm
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Bearings are the heat source? Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days. Learn something new every day!
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat. You are putting this near the very accurate and precise sensor. Inside the thing meant to shield it from it. But ok guys. Keep on with your quixotic adventure!
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
It might only be a few tenths. Which wouldn't register at ASOS. If it's registering as a 20-40 degree rise over ambient it certainly isn't negligible. It's your accuracy that suffers anyway. Oh well.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
It might only be a few tenths. Which wouldn't register at ASOS. If it's registering as a 20-40 degree rise over ambient it certainly isn't negligible. It's your accuracy that suffers anyway. Oh well.
Oh? Why would an ASOS not register a few tenths?? Considering I've dealt with ASOS's professionally since their inception, that's surely news to me.
20-40 degree rise? Where's that coming from :?:
My accuracy suffers? You have no idea what you're talking about and are merely arguing for the sake of trying to save face.
Quit while you're behind, unless you want to continue your uneducated points.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
It might only be a few tenths. Which wouldn't register at ASOS. If it's registering as a 20-40 degree rise over ambient it certainly isn't negligible. It's your accuracy that suffers anyway. Oh well.
Dude, give it up. The ONLY air that the sensor registers is from the bottom. You're just instigating things and are at a losing battle in the discussion here. Go on now.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
It might only be a few tenths. Which wouldn't register at ASOS. If it's registering as a 20-40 degree rise over ambient it certainly isn't negligible. It's your accuracy that suffers anyway. Oh well.
Dude, give it up. The ONLY air that the sensor registers is from the bottom. You're just instigating things and are at a losing battle in the discussion here. Go on now.
You guys have a limited understanding of the fundamentals. What with the "artificial drying of the air".
Pro-tip: heat does not require air or air movement to be transferred. Witness the sun, whose heat travels more than a few miles through the vacuum of space. Ask yourself, "Self, how is this possible?"
This is basic 101 (ok maybe 200 level) type stuff here.
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With high confidence I can say the bearing temperature on AC fan doesn't impact temperatures. Bearings are size of finger tip and the only heat source. The fan casing temperatures actually dropped when I tested yesterday with thermal gun and with everything exhausting out the top I don't see any increase at sensor.
Today cloud cover so no solar advantage with higher speed AC fan with the warmer bearings 96° #1 AC fan and #4 Davis solar are side by side while #5 is my Rainwise backup unit located about 20' away.
All have SHT31's and temperatures within .1 all day. Biggest difference is humidity with #4 sensor reading 2-3% lower but it always reads lower humidity in mid ranges but catches up as humidity rises into 90's.
Didn't realize they were making 100% efficient AC motors these days.
Seriously? If a motor was SO inefficient as to cause heat to be transferred to the sensor, you'd eventually be replacing a burned up motor. These are case fans, not 100 HP building ventilation fans.
Seriously. They draw a certain amount of power. A fair portion of his is turning to pure heat.
No joke. The part you don't want to understand is that it's negligible, if not non-existent at the sensor location. I've used my 67CFM fan for over two years and my obs sure as hell compares very favorably to the ASOS's in my area. I guess their a/c fans must be effecting their obs as well. :roll:
It might only be a few tenths. Which wouldn't register at ASOS. If it's registering as a 20-40 degree rise over ambient it certainly isn't negligible. It's your accuracy that suffers anyway. Oh well.
Dude, give it up. The ONLY air that the sensor registers is from the bottom. You're just instigating things and are at a losing battle in the discussion here. Go on now.
Pro-tip: heat does not require air
Yup, I guess that's why the vacuum of space's temperature is just above absolute zero..... :lol:
Thanks for the tip. ;)
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Ok, chief #-o continue ignoring the source of radiant heat you put inside the radiation shield :lol:
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Ok, chief #-o continue ignoring the source of radiant heat you put inside the radiation shield :lol:
The only thing I'm going to ignore now is you and your completely asinine comments.
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Ok, chief #-o continue ignoring the source of radiant heat you put inside the radiation shield :lol:
The only thing I'm going to ignore now is you and your completely asinine comments.
Ignorance is bliss. Have fun with your fans.