Topic: Please help choose, home WS or handheld one...

[Scoe141]

This will be my first weather station, as you can probably tell by my post count.  I'm glad to be part of so many knowledgeable weather enthusiasts.  Anyway, I've looked through the forum and tried to get some help with my topic by looking at other threads.

I'm trying to decide between a home WS and a portable one.  For the most part, I understand their differences, just not sure which would be best for me. Here's what I want to do:

• Keep tabs on the weather outside my home.  
• I do a lot of hiking and outdoor stuff, so I need to relay on the weather.  I'm not sure if one would be better than the other.
• I would like to log the data, but I don't think I'll be setting up a weather website anytime soon.
• I do love the idea of looking at my desk and knowing what the weather is like outside.
• A handheld meter would be great if I'm on my bike or out in the woods and could keep track of any inclement weather.
• I was looking Davis' WS and Kestrel meters.

My home is another question regarding any WS setup.  I've included a google map view.  The roof is too steep.  I have a front porch, but the anemometer would be blocked by the rest of the home.  I have a shed (which I included) but the wind would be affected by the area trees (which are 40-50ft high).  I have a backyard, but the home and trees would block the wind.  I just want something that would be as accurate as possible.  

I hope this helps and any advice would be much appreciated!

[dkinsc]

With those trees, you might as well give up on accurate wind, and will need to be careful to avoid rain shadow.  I don't know of anything that does double duty as a handheld and full function station, but the Kestrels will log and you can connect that log to a pc via bluetooth.  Since you can't have accurate wind anyway, and you are not presently interested in a website, I would say get a Kestral that gives you data logging of temp, humidity and barometer.  Maybe they all do.  That should keep you busy until you resolve whether to go the full route and log to data served on the web.  Lots of ways to do that, too.  If you to to my CWOP data you will see my aerial shot, similar to yours.  My wind max can be tens of mph lower than the nearby airport.  As long as the comfort of my house has priority over my weather data, I will live with it.

[smorris]

Hi scoe141, and welcome to the forum!

I have both the Davis Vantage Pro2 and the Kestrel 4500 (with vane accessory) and use them for completely different things. As noted above, your site is not going to reflect area-wide wind, but would record what the weather is like in your yard. That's the key; do you want to know what's happening in your microclimate or in the surrounding area. Since you are not doing a web page, you aren't supplying wind conditions for your town or neighborhood. So a Vantage Vue mounted in the most open area of your yard may work fine for you.

As you can see in my avatar, I use my Kestrel when hiking, take it with me on vacations for instant checks of what's happening around me, and I use it to verify the VP2 when I'm near record temps. I haven't used the logging feature of the Kestrel, and did not splurge for the Bluetooth version.

So evaluate whether you want the portability or the computer visibility and logging. Or get both!

Steve

[Scoe141]

dkinsc and steve-  Thank you so much for taking the time to respond.  

dkinsc-  I checked out your website, very nice!  I was thinking I wouldn't be getting accurate wind with my surroundings like you wrote.  I guess that would have been nice, but unless I cut down all of the trees in my area, that won't be happening.  I don't think the neighbors would be too fond of that!

steve- Glad to know you have two of the similar products I was looking at.  I know I was looking at the Vantage Vue and the Kestrel 4500.  I really like the console of the VV and the ability to look at it and know what it's like outside.  With the 4500, I like the portability and if I want to know what its like outside, I suppose I can stick it out the window. How is the accuracy of the wind with the 4500?  I also just checked out your website.  Thanks for showing your setup!  Looks great!

Since the wind reading will be inaccurate in my yard, I really want something that will give me a solid barometric pressure reading, temp. and humidity. The question is, where in my yard will suffice for those accurate readings?  I have a slight hill on the wood line, that would be approximately 30-40 yards from where I would have the console setup.  (This would be on the western or southwestern part of the house.)  Any thoughts?

Thanks again for all the help!

[Scalphunter]

Unless you set an wind vane above 30m you will never get what the true wind conditions are. The wind you get in your yard is what is called ground effect and is subject to friction and  is slower and not even coming from the true direction of the storm, What it is at grounf level it what it is and nothing going to change that. You can get some kind of an idea what is going on but it not the true picture. Your worried about your puny trees  try having 150 foot Sitka spurce trees running along your lot from east thru north to west. A top that there is an 1900 ridge along the backend of the village. That is withing an mile of me . the winds here are never the same as they are on the open channel. But it is my local conditions that I take and report. An micro-clime in many various microclimes along the narrows.

 As to the Kestrel some of the elite combat units carry them, I carry one  for off airport landings. Handy to know just what wind I have for lift in getting out of some small area. Handy nit for portability. Also in winter care one  just to keep eye on temp. Can generally tell temperature from the snow crunch but drop rate is nice.

Might have to add another layer of snow to shelter. Yeah wife and I cold camp when we take the summer fuel supply into summer camp.

John

[Scoe141]

John-  Thanks for putting my home climate area into perspective.  I guess it's not as bad as some!  I'm contemplating which unit to get because I don't want to invest in a Davis, only for it not to be accurate due to my surroundings.  I want to be able to track inclimate weather, storms etc.  I've included some pictures of the area around my home.  I hope these help to advise me of a solid location to setup a weather station, or deter me if it's not practicable.

Thanks again for all the help. 

[DanS]

John-  Thanks for putting my home climate area into perspective.  I guess it's not as bad as some!  I'm contemplating which unit to get because I don't want to invest in a Davis, only for it not to be accurate due to my surroundings.  I want to be able to track inclimate weather, storms etc.  I've included some pictures of the area around my home.  I hope these help to advise me of a solid location to setup a weather station, or deter me if it's not practicable.

Thanks again for all the help. 

Get a Davis Vue or Acurite all-in-one type and install it on a mast 5 feet above ground and out in the open of your yard to avoid rain shadows. You mention being worried with accuracy and by installing this way you should get all measurements pretty good except wind. Even without the trees you would want the temperature, humidity, and rain sensors mounted in this fashion anyway.

[Scoe141]

Get a Davis Vue or Acurite all-in-one type and install it on a mast 5 feet above ground and out in the open of your yard to avoid rain shadows. You mention being worried with accuracy and by installing this way you should get all measurements pretty good except wind. Even without the trees you would want the temperature, humidity, and rain sensors mounted in this fashion anyway.

Makes sense, why I wouldn't want it by the tree line (not only because of the rain shadows, but the risk of falling branches debris etc.)  

With a pole, does it have to be grounded? Or if it was struck by lighting, would it not be affected?  

Thanks for the help.

[SlowModem]

Get a Davis Vue or Acurite all-in-one type and install it on a mast 5 feet above ground and out in the open of your yard to avoid rain shadows. You mention being worried with accuracy and by installing this way you should get all measurements pretty good except wind. Even without the trees you would want the temperature, humidity, and rain sensors mounted in this fashion anyway.

Yep!  That's what I'd do.  If lightning hits it, it's toast, not matter what you have.  However, the likelyhood of that happening is about like me hitting the powerball tonight.

Good luck! 

[DanS]

Get a Davis Vue or Acurite all-in-one type and install it on a mast 5 feet above ground and out in the open of your yard to avoid rain shadows. You mention being worried with accuracy and by installing this way you should get all measurements pretty good except wind. Even without the trees you would want the temperature, humidity, and rain sensors mounted in this fashion anyway.

Makes sense, why I wouldn't want it by the tree line (not only because of the rain shadows, but the risk of falling branches debris etc.)  

With a pole, does it have to be grounded? Or if it was struck by lighting, would it not be affected?  

Thanks for the help.

I wouldn't worry about a 5 or 6 foot pole mounted in the ground. With a wireless station (to the console/pc inside), if it were grounded or not, a strike would isolate it from your home.

[Scoe141]

Makes sense.  I would probably need a galvanized 6' pole, no?  (1-2 feet in the ground)

[DanS]

Sounds good, maybe an 8 footer. 6 feet exposed, 2 feet buried. Galvanized like you say, not PVC to avoid movement and erroneous rain readings.

Some members have had success using pressure treated 4X4 posts (mailbox mounts) as well.

[Scoe141]

Thanks for the advice DanS.  Will definitely have to post some photos after a decision is made.

[VaJim]

take a look at Rainwise...

http://www.rainwise.com/

lots of different options...

[Scoe141]

Get a Davis Vue or Acurite all-in-one type and install it on a mast 5 feet above ground and out in the open of your yard to avoid rain shadows. You mention being worried with accuracy and by installing this way you should get all measurements pretty good except wind. Even without the trees you would want the temperature, humidity, and rain sensors mounted in this fashion anyway.

Yep!  That's what I'd do.  If lightning hits it, it's toast, not matter what you have.  However, the likelyhood of that happening is about like me hitting the powerball tonight.

Good luck! 

hahaha... thanks.  Maybe Ill ask for some funding if you hit the PB!

[dkinsc]

I'm contemplating which unit to get because I don't want to invest in a Davis, only for it not to be accurate due to my surroundings.

Biasing elements in the surroundings to be avoided are shadow of large trees -- affecting mainly wind, but possibly rain; bare dirt or paved area that acts as a moisture releaser or heat sink; structure, which acts as a heat sink.  Somewhere in the middle of those trees is the spot.  Bear in mind your Davis, or other, will likely be accurate within the context of what affects its measurements.  If what affects them are as much open space as you can muster and absence of biases like structures, you will have something that accurately represents its site.  Its site might be quite different from your neighbors or your nearby airport, and so will be your measurements.  But they will be yours.

[Scoe141]

Well said dkinsc.  Much appreciated.  Just trying to decide which unit to get.    ha...

[smorris]

How is the accuracy of the wind with the 4500?

The accuracy of the 4500 is great, and as John said, it is widely used by the military and target shooters for "wind doping." But I don't get the same reading with the Kestrel at 5' as I do with the Davis VP2 anemometer mounted at 30 feet, even when standing out in the bare field behind my house. There's always going to be a difference with surface winds as winds at any elevation.

Steve

[Scoe141]

How is the accuracy of the wind with the 4500?

The accuracy of the 4500 is great, and as John said, it is widely used by the military and target shooters for "wind doping." But I don't get the same reading with the Kestrel at 5' as I do with the Davis VP2 anemometer mounted at 30 feet, even when standing out in the bare field behind my house. There's always going to be a difference with surface winds as winds at any elevation.

Steve

Good to know.  I'll probably hold off on the 4500 for now...  But it's something I'm definitely going to look forward to in the future.  I'm glad to hear of it's accuracy and reliability, especially if our military and aircraft operators use it.

[Bushman]

The 4500 is highly directional though.  I went with a Windtronic 2 Wind Meter - very accurate and multidirectional.

[smorris]

The 4500 is highly directional though.

Yep, I found it harder to use until I got the accessory vane. Still blows around in gusty conditions, but you can't get a good reading like that, anyway. It is a huge improvement over the Bernoulli type wind gauges I used to use when sailing!

[DanS]

How is the accuracy of the wind with the 4500?

The accuracy of the 4500 is great, and as John said, it is widely used by the military and target shooters for "wind doping." But I don't get the same reading with the Kestrel at 5' as I do with the Davis VP2 anemometer mounted at 30 feet, even when standing out in the bare field behind my house. There's always going to be a difference with surface winds as winds at any elevation.

Steve

Elevation differences even in inches can vary wind readings. Something I didn't think about until I mounted my stations and see it happening.

[Scoe141]

How is the accuracy of the wind with the 4500?

The accuracy of the 4500 is great, and as John said, it is widely used by the military and target shooters for "wind doping." But I don't get the same reading with the Kestrel at 5' as I do with the Davis VP2 anemometer mounted at 30 feet, even when standing out in the bare field behind my house. There's always going to be a difference with surface winds as winds at any elevation.

Steve

Elevation differences even in inches can vary wind readings. Something I didn't think about until I mounted my stations and see it happening.

Wow... that's pretty crazy for such a minimal height difference!

[DanS]

Yeah, very similar to rain readings horizontally. A while back I came out of a department store and it was pouring down rain on the right side of the parking lot with the left side bone dry. Just a wall of water down the middle.

[Scoe141]

Yeah, very similar to rain readings horizontally. A while back I came out of a department store and it was pouring down rain on the right side of the parking lot with the left side bone dry. Just a wall of water down the middle.

Nice... that'd make for some interesting weather readings.